Constitution Opinion Poll (read before voting)

[Metal Bunny]

Please Read before Voting.

The articles are in http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/11571-legal-basis-of-gg/#entry102630 With walls of text that include some reasoning and defence.

Also, this is just an opinion poll. Not an actual ratification.
And I know that there is room for improvement. Please, make your suggestions below.

[apophys]

I didn't get to properly understand all of it yet, but I would like to ask what steps are taken to prevent a ruling oligarchy developing.


Also, there is no mention of the method by which legislation would be passed. Is this intentional?
E.g. the legislative branch could make every proposed law into a referendum to all citizens for ratification by majority vote.


And I would like to mention that one should have a right to a fair PUBLIC trial.


Might be a good idea to add an article where a petition directly signed by the majority of the citizenry would become law, in case of everything having gone to hell. (Or some other failsafe to this effect.)

Edited June 8, 2012 by apophys

[Chewett]

Quite honestly, i dont care to try and decipher the long and ardueous document that you have linked. It seems the key points are all in the "long form" including so many "technical" buzzwords that i see no reasoning to waste my time. And would be very tempted just to "randomly vote"

That is my only criticism, Its perfectly fine you want to brush up on all your law writing stuff, but its not going to mean im going to bother to read all the buzzwords, i get enough of them in my job that i need to read.

[BFH]

just a question: who, what or whom are going to enforce such laws?

[Junior]

I lost interest in all the mumbo jumbo of words. (which i dont care to read) But the jist i got out of it was that MD was being directed as a whole. If anything its a great constitution for GG or any land (with a few mods). However i dont see how this can apply to MD when we have guilds, alliances, citizenship, land rules (kings/queens (a joke)), among smaller factions. In my opinion this would overrule all of the mentioned above rules and ideas. for one may claim you broke Lore's Rules but the defendant could argue well what about the MD constitution. (Not quite sure if am making my point) However above all this great idea well written (at least what i read) and all but not sure MD should have an overall constitution.

[Liberty4life]

eh? so how does yoar USA works then? one state has those rules other has that bla bla bla and it all works well

constitution is constitution, the highest law, if xxx territory is some sort of union/federation/confederation or w/e else there is, each state can have its own laws as long as they dont conflict with constitution they have in common

Edited June 9, 2012 by Liberty4life

[Metal Bunny]

Okay, so the biggest form of complaint is that I use buzz words and that it is too tl;dr.
I'll fix that.

@Apophys & BFH, that is still to be decided and I left it blank intentionally. As it depends on how much accountability you want. Probably the legislative force will create and vote for laws and the executive will enforce it.

@ Juni0r.
That is what nr.5 is for. Just like national senate in the U.S.A. can make nation-wide laws, to which all states must obey, so could this new chamber, make GG-wide laws.
Such as.. I dunno, a GG-wide law that some kind of abuse will be punished, or something.

And then, much like in the USA, you'd have state-level laws, with state-level senates.
For GG, this would mean that there could be special laws passed, such as that the Lair Keepers don't have to fight a war, to uphold their role and neutrality.


When I rewrite it, is above a good enough explanation? Or should it be shorter?

[Junior]

yes correct but in my america the constitution was ratified FIRST followed by the states and their laws which complied with the American constitution. Here the "states" have already made rules and practices. They would have to change those practices to fit with the constitution.

Dont get me wrong MB i understand exactly what you are trying to accomplish with the nation wide laws etc however i feel that it wont work as there is already in place laws and common practices. beyond that inho a constitution should be the basis of which all upcoming laws grow from and expand. Here it is the opposite, making a constitution that fits all of the different precedents under a generic idea, which i feel could lead to major exploits and loopholes. Two things we know MD players are experts in abusing.

[Metal Bunny]

So, we'd have a more bare constitution. Tell, me, which laws in this icky constitution of mine, would force current guilds and alliances in GG to behave differently? (This is why I left it so empty).

Perhaps the 'all citizens have a duty to defend GG citizens', but we can remove that or change the wording in that it would just mean support, not actively fight.

And if you do remove it, wouldn't this emptiness be better, since emptiness can't be abused or loopholed?
You'd have emptiness in that part, but still 9 left. Which is something better than it is now, which is just.. pure emptiness when it comes to laws and more importantly, accountability.

And for real abuse that would still happen, we would have judges, or amendments to laws.
And it's not like people will really abuse this right now, will they?
I mean, how do you abuse non-discrimination of sex, religion, etc?

[Chewett]

are these rules intending to replace the current ones? or be an aside?

[BFH]

[quote name='Chewett' timestamp='1339252202' post='114190']
are these rules intending to replace the current ones? or be an aside?
[/quote]
Indeed! I have the same doubt...


Another question:

How many citizens GG have? Such constitution seems like it will need many players to fill those powers. Mainly because, it won't be smart to put the same players to fill up many "positions"

That I guess is another concern I have