2 pyramids isnt equal as 1 cube

[Liberty4life]

oke since mur was always saying that when you put 2 pyramids together you get 1 cube how can that be correct?

cube has 8 vertexes, if you put 2 pyramids together you will get 6 or 7 vertexes (depending how you put them together) so that new thing cant be called cube, but if you put 3 pyramids of specific shape you will get one cube, since cube has 6 squares that means every edge of cube has same length, so to get volume of cube you need to multiply three times cube's edge (a) with itself (a^3)

volume of pyramid with same size of base square as cube is equal to a^2*h/3 (a is square's edge and h is height of pyramid) so 2 pyramids CANT be 1 cube

i really dont understand what mur meant with it, or was he mistaken

[stormrunner]

I could explain it to you but no body explains anything to me, so I'm torment you by telling you it can be done but I'm not going to tell you how

[Chewett]

surely it is based on how you define the pyamid?

also im pretty sure you have to use 3+ pyamids to made a cube.

ie [url="http://www.korthalsaltes.com/foto/cube_made_of_three_pyramids.jpg"]http://www.korthalsaltes.com/foto/cube_mad...ee_pyramids.jpg[/url]

[stormrunner]

thats one way to join the pyamids but it can be done with just two if you use another

[Liberty4life]

i really dont see a way to make cube out of 2 pyramids

[stormrunner]

ok I'll explain your going about it total wrong your just laying them on top of each other and saying ok done

take two 4 sided pyramids of the same size, open them so that the 4 sides are only connected to the base but not each other. then put em togather like two puzzle pieces of couse if you leave it as is it'll not be right but just compress the edges that are out so that it fits right, I don't have the art skills to make a nice pretty picture for you or to make it but trust me it works

p.s. sorry if it worded badly but hopeful you get the idea

[Liberty4life]

hmm yea i see.... but... to take apart pyramids into squares and triangles and then put them together into cube, well thats kinda correct, but thats physically impossible so to speak

[stormrunner]

not impossible it oh couse depends on what the pyramids are made out of but lets assume we're in MD use Principles, it your turn to do some thinking

[Liberty4life]

yes exactly, i see it more like dimensional stuff

[stormrunner]

I just explained in a hands on way thinking of it. the way you were isn't how you need to think drop all that complex stuff you have at the first post and think like a 5 year ago, it suddenly not so hard. your over thinking it.

actually I am to take those same sized pyramids and put the bases togather, will not work every time but can work

Edited April 22, 2009 by stormrunner

[Muratus del Mur]

stormrunner is ..somehow ..right.. you could do geometry tricks and build it with two 4 sided pyramids that are empty so you could use their sides (not quite like he describes) .. but its not the geometry that is building the cube.
Its kind of dificult to explain it here ... normaly i wouldnt do this, but since its too confusing to be solved and it was never a competition to get to pyramids to build a cube, here it is...

you get the two golemus pyramids, rotate them just a bit, you will get a rhomboidal shape ... now think... its not quite geometry that is needed ... what is the relation of that shape with a cube? ..it has a cube IN it and OUTSIDE it .. its more of a cube symbol than the cube itself. And the golemus cube got used so you cant expect and actual cube to lie there , consider it a cube "corpse" in a symbolic but also geometric meaning.

think about it
some things that you need to solve dont have all their clues and solutions on the same plane of understanding. Sometimes when you receive a pen and a paper and are told they build together a sphere, maybe it means the spear _drawing_ is the one missing from the paper, not that they geometricaly build a sphere if put together.

its an intuitive solution that contradicts with logic if looked from the wrong angle, but in human nature intuition is sometimes even more than logic, so the answer that the rhomboidal shape "feel" like a cube because its corners and middle of each side touch a cube shape, is ..surprisingly valid...especialy when the kelletha pyramids are what is left from a cube, but not geometrical parts of it.

Now, i told you a lot but there is still a lot to figure out, is this cube the one lost by knaty, did the shades use it did they even got it, if the kelletha cube remains are there presented in such an official position , is that a clue about the land? how would look a cube after beeing used for something else? what is the cube, what was the cube, what was it made of, what is the other one made of, how many cubes there are actualy ....many questions...and some of them hold the answer in the question itself...

Book of Principles story was never actualy solved by anyone, maybe it was never supposed to be solved, or maybe you never looked at it in the right way ... but clues are out there, constantly kept fresh by feeding the mystery to people that keep it, that each searches for its own mission and hopes to find its little secret, but in fact they all hold the answers in their own hands.

ever wondered why the sphere in the latest AL, or why the cube on the floor, or who or what the traveler is? ... am i surprising you if i tell you all things connect and that none of it are separate stories actualy? ...

i am playing my game too you know...

[stormrunner]

[quote name='King Manu' post='29243' date='Apr 22 2009, 04:58 PM']stormrunner is ..somehow ..right.. you could do geometry tricks and build it with two 4 sided pyramids that are empty so you could use their sides (not quite like he describes)[/quote]

it shockly how oftend that happens with me. I sometimes think oddly and somehow it comes out right more oftend then it wrong

[Liberty4life]

[quote name='King Manu' post='29243' date='Apr 22 2009, 11:58 PM']you get the two golemus pyramids, rotate them just a bit, you will get a rhomboidal shape ... now think... its not quite geometry that is needed ... what is the relation of that shape with a cube? ..it has a cube IN it and OUTSIDE it .. its more of a cube symbol than the cube itself. And the golemus cube got used so you cant expect and actual cube to lie there , consider it a cube "corpse" in a symbolic but also geometric meaning.[/quote]
ah well two pyramids placed in a way as floating pyramid at kellethas, you get rhomboidal shape yes, that means... 8 more pyramids are missing to make a cube... and there in golemus are 7 pyramids what means one more is missing... well look at this [url="http://www.math.utah.edu/~cherk/ccli/bob/PlatoVol.swf"]http://www.math.utah.edu/~cherk/ccli/bob/PlatoVol.swf[/url]

[Muratus del Mur]

my point was, stormrunner, that it doesnt matter you were tehnicaly close to an answer, because the answer was not of that TYPE.

[stormrunner]

ok

[Muratus del Mur]

Kelle'tha pyramids build an octaeder, a reminiscence pointing to the cube
because of its duality to that shape. There is a cube inside it and one outside
it, the pyramids of the mountain are like the skelleton of that cube, since the
cube was activated and not just lieng there. They form a cube together in
that sense, they are whats left of the cube. The cube is not a box afterall,
its part of a special series of shapes, dont expect to find the others in geometrical
representation necessarly. The principles put together form an other shape, but then in turn if that would be all i wouldnt just give you the answers directly would i ....

the cube connection to the octaedra processed through your mind, without thinking of its mathematical reason, triggers your intuition, putting two pyramids together forms a cube for most, and why, because its tehnicaly incorrect..so...

i am giving you to many clues and i am sorry, it makes you lazy and me disapointed that i have to tell you secrets, it cuts off the satisfaction of finding them.

So here you are, 5 shapes in this world ..only that they are not shapes anymore ..they are allready USED

if i tell you more i get angry

[stormrunner]

that makes perfect sense and makes me feel kind of dumb for my answer

[Kyphis the Bard]

Doesn't that actualy mean two pyramids equals two cubes?
Or is it a single voided cube?
---
Forgeting the geometric nature of the cube:
Wouldn't of anyone who was able to understand this puzzle, the first cube they saw be a reflection on the person themselves? Whether it was the internal cube you saw first or the external... I would say that a persons inability to solve the puzzle also says something about them, but since almost no one got it that would be pretty hard to define...

[Kragel]

actually this example could go for infinity smaller or larger

nice topic :good:

[Dark]

Questions, questions... that's what I have. Here are a couple of them.

If you have answers, please post. If you have ideas, please post. If you have chocolate, I'll be over in ten minutes.

When the Sentinel vanished it left behind a cube. Does that mean it is like us? Does that mean it came from a cube as we did? I was under the impression that the cube(s) were a sort of container (whether self made or made by an outside force is for another argument) - a container that we continue to "outgrow" and explore.

Let's say for argument that the Sentinel's core being or soul is inside the cube... Is that what constitutes death in MD? Can it happen to one of us? Will the Sentinel learn to use it's mind and outgrow his cube and then be back in the same "cube" with the rest of us? You see, I've come to think of this realm as a cube as well. One that we have only just begun to explore, but a cube none-the-less.

That sphere... That's odd indeed. From what I have experienced, MD is all about flat geometry... cubes, pyramids, lines, balance... Yet there is the overriding principle of Cyclicity which implies a circle or sphere as a means of maintaining the balance in a fluid manner. And if you look at Mur's graphics you can put a sphere inside and outside of each of those shapes as well... So, does the sphere just mean the Traveler is completely alien to MD or does it mean that the Traveler is a more balanced (inclusive) part of MD? Or something else entirely.

I know that many in MD search for concrete solutions to puzzles and that is why the fixation on the pyramids geometry. So, I say , more power to you for trying to figure out how to reconstruct the used cube and find the missing pieces, if they exist. But for me, the questions will remain. My questions aren't of shape and form, but are of existence and purpose. Why was that cube used? How was it used? What might happen if the cube left by the Sentinel is used? What does MD have to gain or lose by the answers?

Now that I'm sure you all think I'm insane I'll go for a while. I assure you I have only scratched the surface of the questions I have. But I'll stop torturing you now.

If you want to keep me quiet for a longer period of time, I suggest distracting me with chocolate... and/or Chippendale dancers. >_>

[Muratus del Mur]

you allready have many answers in your questions ..right there.
i will give you just one of it more obviously so you udnerstand what i mean by answers in a question...

you say the traveler might be more ballanced because it turned to that sphere .. you are missing that both entities as missing, what if you are right, put that theory together with the shade that is missing and recalculate

[awiiya]

This is just going off of feelings... but...

A cube is generally related to constriction and order. Humans are associated with cubes, because we create limits for ourselves, we put walls up around us to protect us from the spiral nature of the world. For humans to grow, they break out of a box into the next box, and that box gets progressively bigger. It is the passing from one box to the next that order events for us.

Shades are associated more with spirals or circles than cubes, because they never end, they have no perception of time. Shades do not grow, perhaps they do not even change. In any case, they flow (black water).

So then, it is strange to imagine the Shade Sentinel turning into a white box. For one, it is white, and for another, it is a cube. Shades are not, to me, related to cubes like humans are. To capture a Shade in a cube... is not something I consider possible anymore.

This leaves me with one plausible explanation. The Shade Sentinel did not get captured in a cube, but rather left behind a cube when she left. Perhaps for a human to open, a human to grow out of? Maybe, then, the traveler is imitating the Shade Sentinel? Maybe the traveler is going to Deathmarrow to assume the Shade Sentinel's position, though I find that unlikely.

Then there is the question of why the Traveler turned into a Sphere... like the Shades, I think the traveler is more characterized by spheres rather than cubes. The traveler entered MD freely, he did not need to grow out of a cube like the rest of us. So that much makes sense...

Who is the traveler? I'm not sure I know yet. Is he a symbolic representation of change? Is he even a he? Anyone have any thoughts?

Awi

[Liberty4life]

hmm murs picture of cube and two pyramids is interesting how he placed them inside each other, positioning it like that makes it now harder for me, before i had idea... but maybe he placed them just becoz of easier presenting

well awiiya this is it you said cube represents order, well order balance more or less same things at least from mur's lecture called order by chaos, so traveler is from other world not from this one, well shades are too they arent from our world, in story shades balance they needed to get balanced, before everything was balanced until shades came, when shades came humans needed to change to achieve again balance, at least thats how i understand it, and now traveler came and it seams that he is perfect match for balancing shades

[Dark]

[quote name='King Manu' post='29256' date='Apr 22 2009, 08:44 PM']you say the traveler might be more ballanced because it turned to that sphere .. you are missing that both entities as missing, what if you are right, put that theory together with the shade that is missing and recalculate[/quote]

Matter and anti-matter? hmmm... No, not quite, because they didn't cancel one another and we are all still here. So, they... combined?
One absorbed the other?

No. I don't think so, because a cube was left behind.

I'll have to stew on that for a bit. But thanks for the clues

[Muratus del Mur]

awiiya you have some very good ideeas there.
Liberty, fully correct