The Traveler

[awiiya]

On that note I started this thread not as a place to speculate about the player behind the Traveler, but the Traveler and the actions he will inevitably make.

Awi

[dst]

Awwww...there goes to the toilet my perfect theory about Santa...

[Grido]

lol dst

and just to clarify i was fully aware at the time that Mur was only imitating The Traveler (hence my including his avy), i just found it amusing so decided to post a screeny here

[Liberty4life]

funny thing is that according to picture i was there but i really dont remember that XD lol maybe mur is playing with my account too XD

[Ren]

You guys keep veering very off topic. I haven't deleted any posts because I only vaguely care. But, the rules must be followed or the threads have no respect. Please return to topic.

I don't really have anything to add to the speculation here, though. So, I'm off topic too. ;

[awiiya]

No news is good news, as the phrase goes. However I hope there is news soon.

Awi

[Dark]

I remember [i]Ghost Busters[/i].

The Traveler was the means of destruction - The Destroyer. And The Destroyer's shape was determined by those it set out to destroy. In the case of the movie...

"It's the Stay-Pufft marshmallow man."

Something similar here perhaps? A link to Khalazdad's "destroyer" and The Traveler might exist.

But then again, I'm just a n00b playing at a guessing game. *smiles*

[stormrunner]

thats a thought better get my ghostbusting gear now where did I put those nuclear accelerators

though I hope mysti doesn't turn into a giant dog

[Chewett]

[Redacted]

Edited December 18, 2012 by Chewett
Redacted

[Yami no Sakura]

*resurrects the moldy topic*

The new AL updates are getting me thinking again. Mind you, this isn't a theory. It's just me thinking out loud.

Who is this Traveler? As far as I know, not many people can just drop cubes like that. That is, assuming that he's the one who made the cube appear in the AL. I'm talking about page 466, by the way, in case anyone wants the reference.

In any case, I came across something curious while I was rereading the AL:

[quote]Page 445 [2009-02-20 06:46:16 - The Traveler]
Outside Necrovion, the other part of the Traveler walks as a regular human among others, fighting for his experience, training his creatures and perfecting his techniques. Memories between the two parts synchronize from time to time, [color="#FF0000"]but memories can be easily intercepted by someone that can understand time.[/color][/quote]

It's just a thought, but maybe there's a way to learn about the Traveler. I'm no expert on the Principles, so someone who has studied the Time Principle might want to give this some thought.


Feel free to give your own input, btw.

Edited April 17, 2009 by Yami no Sakura

[stormrunner]

[quote]Time control can be accomplished by juggling with the way in which actions are perceived and understood. For instance, by perceiving the way from one place to another not as a string of actions but as an independent thing one can understand movement without the notion of time. When a string of actions (no matter how complex) is understood through a continuous thought, any composing piece of action can be accessed and perceived, therefore the past, present and future can be perceived and controlled from the perspective of a superior existence/identity that oversees them.[/quote]

if one has studied time and can see things from that higher state. you can perceive things in a diffent way that allow you to tap into those memories. don't ask for a full explaintion I still only have a rough understanding on time myself. I'll post more or edit this when I fully work this out

I think Syntropy and darkness would also be of use to help perceive things diffently oh and note this is all only my theory on how this would work, so I could be wrong

[Udgard]

One thing that pops to my mind when talking about time and memory is about the land and the shades, who sees the past and the future alike, and thus have memories not affected by time the normal way an ordinary mind is.

[awiiya]

It has been a long time since I gave attention to my own board, and so I think I will post a few ideas.

It is very clear that this traveler is not from this world, and that his intentions are driven by curiosity and self-indulgence rather than anything else.

As for Shade Sentinel, I have no doubt that she will be fine... however she may be weak unless something is done to find her very soon.

She is trapped in a cube, and I ask, what is the best way to unlock a cube? Seeing as a cube, a six-sided shape lies clearly in the logical realm, I say that the best key to a logical figure is something rather illogical.

As in the case of the entrance to the Pyramid that Akasha and Alche entered, I think the answer lies in a illogical solution. We need to believe, and not just believe but understand, that the Shade Sentinel is no longer in that cube. Once we have molded the world to our thought, she will be released, and this traveler will have no more power than a mouse. This is, after all, our world. The Traveler is but an explorer, and we are the rulers and inhabitants of this world.

Let's take it back

Awi

Edited April 22, 2009 by awiiya

[Jester]

Trying to believe in something is incredibly difficult, we as humans need to see proof that something is working. Not many people can simply will themselves into believing something. I think this is a good idea, but if we actually do something to try to unlock the cube, and start to believe that it is working, then your idea will kick in. What I find funny is that if it works, we'll have no idea whether it worked because it was the right answer, or simply because we believed in it.

Also, when did we start caring about the well being of shades? I must have missed a memo.

[Watcher]

On the contrary, humans are one of the most gullible species in existence. They 'need to see something to believe it'? You could not be more wrong. All a human needs is the [b]suggestion[/b] that something [i]might be[/i] working and they will fill in the blanks as they desire, jumping to all the conclusions they wish to see.

All that is needed is a charismatic leader to begin telling everyone what they want to hear and the humans will be all to happy to fall in line.


Of course, there are those who do require more than just suggestions and chicanery to believe in something. However, they are very few and far, far between.

[awiiya]

As to Jester's post, I believe that the answer that works is and always will be the right answer.

This is the definition of "right" isn't it? What works is right, and it will continue to be right until it stops working, and then it will be viewed as wrong.

As for Watcher's argument, seeing is the most powerful form of suggestion there is. It is not necessary, of course, but in a way a powerful leader telling you something is equal to a weak leader showing you that it is.

How can we be sure our eyes are not lying to us any more than a leader? There are many many cases where our eyes are proven to be not as infallible as we'd like to believe, and so what they see is a suggestion of the truth.

The basic idea is this: the suggestion becomes more than a suggestion when the suggestion is believed, and that is what I am kindly asking the general population of Magicduel to do. Believe.

I can tell you with utmost certainty that Shade Sentinel is and always will be free, and is too powerful to be contained in a simple cube.

Awi

Edited April 22, 2009 by awiiya

[Watcher]

No, awiiya, the definition of "right" has nothing to do with whether it is one solution to any given problem. There are many ways for a poor man to obtain money. There are many ways a leader can inspire his troops. However, not all of the answers are "right" just because they lead to the desired end. Some solutions are still "wrong" even if they accomplish the same goal as the right ones.


Also, what makes you believe that the cube is "simple"? Because you believe it to be so? If the Shade Sentinel [u]is[/u] contained, does that change the "complexity" of the cube?

Edited April 22, 2009 by Watcher

[awiiya]

This argument has the potential to dissolve into a lame argument about definitions.

The definition of right is relative, yours is different than mine, and I am willing to leave it at that.

I think that the cube is simple because I know it must be so. Shade Sentinel does not need our help, she has all the strength in the land to escape it by himself. The cube has no bound on her immortal and ethereal shape. This I know, and it must be so.

Awi

Edited April 22, 2009 by awiiya

[Jester]

Sigh.... sarcasm mode on. Next time I'd appreciate it if you would be more polite when "correcting" me.

When I said "see" something, I wasn't referring only to vision. I meant seeing results, as in hearing about them from a source they consider reliable, or reading them, or however you wish to say it. I didn't realize I would need to elaborate, please excuse my ignorance regarding your ignorance.

As to what is "right", and what is "wrong", that is a matter of no small debate. However, I believe Awiiya was referring to "what is right" meaning what the solution is, and not what is "right" ethically. When I solve a puzzle using the correct combination, I rarely find myself pondering the moral implications.

As to what you actually said aside from "correcting" me, that was basically my point. People can't tell themselves to believe in something, they need an outside source to tell them.

Anyway, that was a fun exercise in sarcasm. This will be the only sarcastic reply I post, because there is no point in continuing the argument. I merely enjoy sarcasm now and then.

[Thanatopic]

'but memories can be easily intercepted by someone that can understand time.'

(ooc)

There are two major viewpoints on time, at least as far as I've come to understand it. There are those that live constrained by time, experiencing each moment as it comes and goes. "past" and "future" are just concepts to one who's life is measured in moments, the only real thing is now. That's all we, as mortals, ever experience, is right now. We remember the past, and ponder the future, but the present is all we get at any given point. This is the impetus for us actually doing anything, because we feel the moments slipping by, and we know that we are only given so many moments. You could extend this to immortality as well, to some extent. But not Omnipotence, or more Importantly omniscience.

It's often said that time is like a river, always flowing; I however have never found that particular metaphor fitting. I prefer to think of time as a book, probably because I'm a religious man. This leads into the other view point on time; the one who is not bound by it's constraints. You can think of this as one who wrote the book of reality, or one who is reading it. They can flip through the pages as they will, open the book wheresoever they desire. The -entirety- of time is there to behold, and can be gleaned as one wishes.

So, if one were to have this outsiders perspective of time, which is entirely possible for one who has come to understand Time, they would be able to 'read' something they were'nt there to see, and intercept the memory by bearing witness to the event. This however is problematic, because perception has as much to with reality as fact.

In regards to divination, there are also two camps. That, however, is an entirely different discussion; as such it has no bearing on this thread.

[Dark]

My understanding from discussion with Khalazdad, is that the shades experience time the way they do because they [i]exist[/i] within their time all at once. Sort of like a smeared thumb print (my analogy, not his). In other words, shades to not "remember" but rather, they [i]exist[/i] in all their time at once. Also, they are not infinite but rather have a finite time in which they exist. Thus my analogy of a smeared thumb print. He likes to say they "swim in a pool of time."


As to the nature of the Traveler... I'm still uncertain. The other thread is beginning to give me inklings of something, but I'm far from any sort of understanding of it. Right now we are reading about only half of it in the AL. And what we are told is that it is communicating with itself through "memory"

We are also told that someone with an understanding of time can intercept the memories. This would be Khalazdad's role, but he's got other things on his mind right now. So perhaps his daughter will emerge from inner Necro with knowledge of time... Perhaps.

[Thanatopic]

I've been reading some different historic Documents, and these are a few things that I've come upon.
It was covered by spoiler tags, but it was a discussion on the adventure log, so if i'm overstepping my bounds please just delete this post. Either way i'll spoiler tag it.

Please bear with me, i can be frenetic at times
[spoiler]
I read that shades have no individuality, Incapable of having unique experiences is the way it was put. The comment on the circular shape referring to balance is key to where I'm taking all of this.
I think the returning of the moon, and inherently night, also plays a part into everything that's going on.

So you have a creature, that is First among those that have no individuality, their commander. It could be conceived then that this creature is in fact the individuality, that all the other shades are bits of her. In the previous adventure log story wasn't there often the description of her leaving black liquid in her wake. So what then would happen when the First among a faceless mob, what may in fact be the heart of that mob, the reflection in every mirror; what happens when this First is taken by a creature that is thought to embody balance and change?

I think it is also key to note that the Traveler leaves dust from what he destroys, but the shade sentinel merely disappeared; a white cube was left where it stood. Something without boundaries to break cannot Grow. So I do not believe that the shade sentinel is 'trapped' any more than any of us are held by our boundaries.

The moon and the night have returned to this world, and i don't believe it an accident that the Traveler appeared shortly thereafter. In the night we all become faceless, we all lose identity to those around us in the darkness. However, at the same time, in the lonely embrace of the dark when the world is still, we can come to know ourselves better than in the hustle and shine of the day. Is it not fitting then that the creatures which so closely resemble night would undergo a change all for the sake of balance. ? Is it not so unlikely that the first among them, the one whom I believe is the picture that is reflected among the lack of individuality, would be the catalyst; again, for the sake of balance?


[/spoiler]

Edited April 24, 2009 by Thanatopic

[Willem RedBeard]

As I am searching for the cube, I decided to read through this topic. A lot of interesting thinking and ideas. It is great to speculate on how to unlock or open the cube, but I am wondering if it might also be helpful to examine it first. Going along with this thought, has anyone here personally seen the white cube mentioned in the AL, or was witness to the events when the cube appeared?

*edit*: Also any further information on the "traveler" might also be helpful in revealing the nature of the cube.

Edited May 7, 2009 by Willem RedBeard

[Dazac]

Well, I'm not entirely sure what The Traveler and Adventure logs are all about, or how to get involved with it(anyone know? Cause I'd love to join in!)

On the concept of Time, I believe that in order to really and truly understand it, one must realize and then think in four dimensions instead of the three we often do. We must be aware that just because something is as we see it in the present, doesn't mean it always was like it is, or always will be as it is. Time is a fickle thing, and as mortal beings we can do no more than predict a (relatively of course) a short ways into the future. In that sense however we are able to see the future, and thus change it.
Here's an example: Say you're outside in the rain, waiting for a bus. It's been raining steadily all day and the streets are covered in water and there are big pools on the side of the roads. You're standing very close to one and are aware of it. You look to see a car is speeding down the road, awfully close to the curb and realize that they are going to hit the puddle and splash the water on you. You see this in your head, experience it even, thus in a sense seeing the future. This simple fact gives the opportunity to alter what will happen, thereby changing insignificantly or significantly(I think most of us aren't truly aware of how the insignificant things truly are quite significant.) what happens. You've seen in your minds eye what will happen, and so you step out of the way, avoiding being splashed. You've just thought in 4 dimensions because you're aware that, in an amount of time, something would happen and you only have that amount of time to do anything about it.


I'd go on, but I don't want to ramble too much. Taking note on the subject of balance, I read something, though I can't quite recall all of it; something to do with the shades, balance, and some sort of orb like thing, I wonder, has anyone considered ying and yang?