Fighter Level

[Blackwoodforest]

I have an idea and I guess it will fit here.
How about creating a "fighter level" for each mindpower level (or only mp4 and mp5). The fighter level could start at level A and counting from a range of stats like 50-150 attack (just as example). Fighter level B will start at 151 attack and so on.
Each fighter level will be compare before a fight cumulates all stats and boosts and divides income and outcome into a percentage way.
Like this.
Player 1, fighter level C attacks Player 2, fighter level A.
All stats/counts for Player 1 will be counted only x0.8 times because he is 2 level above. Outcome will be devided as well.
Means a grinder Fighter level ZZ player will need to find someone near his fighting level to get a good income/outcome balance.

Got my idea behind it?

[Chewett]

What about tokens? because they can booast a normal persons stats, into massively stronger.

And also, what happens if someone have a massively high stat? will that mean he is in one of the higher bands?

I like the idea, im just trying to think about how it will work overall

[Pipstickz]

Each stat should have a certain weight to it. For example, tradesense has nothing to do with fighting, so it would mean nothing toward this.

Otherwise, I think this is a good idea, except for a few things:

a) There are already a limited number of people to fight; perhaps it should only be active on certain days?
b) What if you have high stats, but don't know how to fight very well, or don't have certain creatures?
c) What if you have high stats, but use 0% slider?
d) What about scaling for different MP levels? Strong in MP3 is very different from strong in MP5.

[Laphers]

Just a thought but what would happen if the relevant stats were divided by the active day count? Those who are active fighting/grinding will still be stronger than someone who doesn't fight a lot but it will mean that length of time in game will not mean that someone who is brand new can't stand a chance against the veterans. It also allows more focus on learning how to build rituals properly.

As I said, this is just a thought based on reading the above conversations but I thought I'd throw it out there to let people think about it and respond.

[Chewett]

[quote name='Pipstickz' date='06 June 2010 - 03:20 AM' timestamp='1275790814' post='61105']
a) There are already a limited number of people to fight; perhaps it should only be active on certain days?
b) What if you have high stats, but don't know how to fight very well, or don't have certain creatures?
c) What if you have high stats, but use 0% slider?
d) What about scaling for different MP levels? Strong in MP3 is very different from strong in MP5.
[/quote]

A) Now that would be an intresting idea, i would like this.
B) surely that should be your own fault? since the system should be based on strategy and learning.
C) That will mean tokens are fully active, and i think these should probably be scaled down also, since they are a major part of combat (to the point of people being able to kill without stats)
D) either have different bands between the mindpowers, or make it a graduated band system, you slowly get a larger letter.

[quote name='Laphers' date='06 June 2010 - 05:31 AM' timestamp='1275798698' post='61112']
Just a thought but what would happen if the relevant stats were divided by the active day count? Those who are active fighting/grinding will still be stronger than someone who doesn't fight a lot but it will mean that length of time in game will not mean that someone who is brand new can't stand a chance against the veterans. It also allows more focus on learning how to build rituals properly.

As I said, this is just a thought based on reading the above conversations but I thought I'd throw it out there to let people think about it and respond.
[/quote]

Since people who are younger will have less of a cap, This will only effect people who are stronger at lower Active days, So in effect this will only help the Grinders who managed to train up really strong characters really quickly. I doubt this idea will be as useful since the grinders will have the benefit.

[Pipstickz]

[quote name='Chewett' date='06 June 2010 - 01:24 AM' timestamp='1275809086' post='61119']
B) surely that should be your own fault? since the system should be based on strategy and learning.
[/quote]
I was talking specifically about (some of the) GGG-farmers >>

[Chewett]

[quote name='Pipstickz' date='06 June 2010 - 08:43 AM' timestamp='1275810194' post='61122']
I was talking specifically about (some of the) GGG-farmers >>
[/quote]

If they want to use GGG and have no idea about the fight system Good, it means i can kill more people.

Its their choice if they want to learn or not, Ritual strength and a little bit of luck should be more about this game, not just massive stats, so anything that evens that out a bit i like.

Obviously the bonus conveyed should still make the stronger player strong, But It should be enough of a reduction to give the person a slight higher chance of killing them.

[Burns]

I'd bet there was something similar with honor-system, but i simply can't find it...

I find that thingie flawed in that way: It doesn't help newbies, at all.
When you take a grinders stats and multiply them with .05, they are still over the stats a young player can reach.
And as the young player goes on and gets stronger, the multiplicator for the vet gets better and better, and newbie can't catch up, their target values always get pushed out further and further as they advance.

And, lowered gain means more kills for the same gain. Not very bright imo, most vets don't target for a certain ammount of kills a day, but for a certain ammount of wins, xp, or stats. If maxing my joker takes more kills, i'll kill more, not kill longer.

I think that the idea of having stats influence whom you can attack (as base of honor systems) is sensible, but the way you proposed it, it doesn't stop me from killing a newbie when i feel like. It just makes me kill the newbie probably 4 times instead of 2 for the same gain.

[Blackwoodforest]

[quote name='Pipstickz' date='06 June 2010 - 04:20 AM' timestamp='1275790814' post='61105']
Each stat should have a certain weight to it. For example, tradesense has nothing to do with fighting, so it would mean nothing toward this.

Otherwise, I think this is a good idea, except for a few things:

a) There are already a limited number of people to fight; perhaps it should only be active on certain days?
b) What if you have high stats, but don't know how to fight very well, or don't have certain creatures?
c) What if you have high stats, but use 0% slider?
d) What about scaling for different MP levels? Strong in MP3 is very different from strong in MP5.
[/quote]

Like Chewett already said some things:

a) no, it shall be based on skills, active days dont say anything at all
b) your own fault, if you want to fight in high classes, learn how to fight and not how to grind!
c) refers to b) learn how to fight, but once you reached a fighter level, be sure what to do
d) scaling in mp levels in not involved. A fighter level counts only in his mindpower range. SO a fighter in level C mind mp3 is not compareable to a fighter in level c mp5!

There is much work to figure out how to do this and how it shall work and be counted but the idea is great imho.
Each fighter will gain wins, but a high level fighter will gain alomst or even none XP for fighting a lower fighter level.

[Pipstickz]

[quote name='Blackwoodforest' date='06 June 2010 - 02:14 AM' timestamp='1275812057' post='61135']
a) no, it shall be based on skills, active days dont say anything at all
[/quote]
You misunderstand me - I meant that perhaps it should only affect things on certain days.

[Nex]

just tossing out random ideas from the top of my head here. they'd have a [b]radical[/b] impact, possibly not in harmony with the original core-concept of MDs battle system, so just view them as a possible inspiration rather than fleshed-out ideas:


- combat ranks A - xyz (not sure how many), A being the highest xyz being a new mp3

- fullfilling certain creteria (not only stats, maybe some tests a la lorerootguards to see if you really understood the possibilities of your current level) lets you ascend to the next higher rank. starts easy and tutorial-like, with some really hard tests for high-end mp5

- each mp level has a max rank, certain ranks unlock new things/mechanics.

- (ranks are not required to advance to the next mp level, but some of the finer points of combat won't be available until you get them)

- some ranks permanently unlock small boni
(slightly increased caps, rank being an upgrade requirement for some creatures' later levels), while other increase the complexity and potential power of the combat system [heat/erolin device, appliable stats being capped per rank (you can get more, but they won't be used in battle until you reach the next rank. mostly to prevent godlike mp3), some auras unlockable at mid-high mp3, creatureboost only later at later mp levels?, tokens only having combat effects starting at high-ish mp4 ranks?!, etc, etc.]

- if 2 players of a different rank fight, the lower rank will determine the complexity (i.e.: old mp4 A could use token effects, new mp4 B couldn't -> tokens won't have effects in this battle).
all unlocked boni (effective caps, creature levels, etc) of vet player A are kept, giving him/her an edge for coming this far, while keeping it generally fair.


->
that would mean not everything is accessible right from the start, you'd have to earn the chance to play around with more complex stuff. you also couldn't overwhelm newbies with the more complex/powerful mechanics, but you still get to keep some boni for being more experienced and having made it that far.
having to actually understand the combatsystem to advance to the higher fighter ranks would mean that if you don't understand the first thing about rits and basic creatures all the grinding and tokens in the world wouldn't help you, because you couldn't pass the requirements/'tests' to unlock the corresponding complexity level.

Edited June 6, 2010 by Nex

[Miq]

I just wanted to post a succession to make stats gain dependent of the fighters "level" but as i see i have been preceded.

Anyway what i tought is that you calculate stat gain multiplier (like heat) for the attacker (only attacker) based on the difference of age,amount of crits,number of fights fought,stats, (age being the least relevant). That multiplication can also go to negative at some point. That would give the new chance to catch up and protect the from win farming.

In any case is see this as being quite logical. The young have more to gain experience wise from fighting old players than vice versa.