Gazebo Of Victory

[battilaa]

Gazebo of Victory!
Have one on the House

Names of participants according to rules:
-Placeholder

Names of offenders:
-Placeholder


Rules:
Please set 3-6 level 4-5 Trees on Martirism in your defending ritual. With 0% Personal VE. We don’t want you yourself getting hurt.

Attacking rituals should try to achieve victories, preferably without breaking the defenders. Loosing at least 10% of own VE and 40-50% of the attacker VE.

Please try damaging less, end then working yourself up from there step by step.

Edited January 13, 2010 by battilaa

[phantasm]

this is wrong on so many levels. It's one thing to farm wins for creatures you turn around and sac for nothing. It is another to EARN victories. Victories are just that..hard earned, and well deserved wins. To open a ground so that everyone could achieve a balance would destory any kind of value that victories have. It's one of the few hard things left to do in this game.

[Burns]

I have also been against the idea of farming wins on sacc-creatures for free, and still people seem to like it, so why not give that victory thing a chance, too?

I don't see its future myself, because all those grinder weaklings from GGG would much rather stay off balance to avoid honor issues and scream fire and revenge(/call MRD to help them -.-) when they get the few welldeserved losses that push them over the brink, but i'm sure battilla invested more than the few seconds of thought in it that i just put in to write this post...

Good Luck with your idea, whereever it ends^^

[Chewett]

As both have said before, This is hideous.

Victories are something that are earnt as both before me has said, and if you have easy places to get them also, Where next?

You already have a place to stat farm, cant you get victories either?

This is not a game where everything is given to you, you need to use strategy so that you can get victories. its easy, even if you do lose 100%

I am sorry to say this Battila, but it wont work, nor do i wish you luck in this, because it is against what the game is.

[battilaa]

Yeah i get it. Well at least in theory it would work.

[Chewett]

It would be useful, as i need tonns of victories to get balanced, but i dont think its in the spirit of MD, im weak, so im training up my dracorns and such.

And slowly im getting victories.

[Dmik King]

I don't understand why this place is not allowed? its not against any rule, no bug abuse same like training in GGG, just for wins of the character and not for creatures. I don't think that this place is illegal unless Mur will make new law about it. This law should be related to GGG as well!

It will also help balance between new players and veterans that got too big advantage....

Edited January 11, 2010 by Dmik King

[Pipstickz]

No one said it wasn't allowed, it just won't receive much public support from people who disagree with it.

[Dmik King]

If this place will be open and will get advertised enough it will be popular until certain point. alternate characters will also help this place if it will get opened: like gogu and venger and MRD's friends in GGG.

[Chewett]

it wont work practically

Look at GGG for example, lets just look at mp5

There are normally around 10 mp5's there, of which normally 2 or 3 are active.
If you are attacking everyone every 8 minutes with those 2 people the 20 ideling rits will be broken in around 80 minutes.
Then once they are broken they will start going random and you could get anything, aramors to Rusties.

Now as the exchange for loss to vic, is one to one, then whats the reason to idle? to get more losses? which is exatly what you didnt want

So unless you can get a lot of people, with a lot of ve, healing themselves constantly, then how will you keep up the rate needed to sustain something?

[Dmik King]

its possible to put in there one or 2 alternate and farm wins from them. Someone will have to be in charge of them and they should have plenty of defense rituals.

This place should be open by request and not daily - like dojo of losing exp.

[Grido]

...and that can be considered alt abuse

Edited January 11, 2010 by Grido

[Chewett]

Not considered, Definate alt abuse, and you will lose a lot of honor from them as they will gather so many losses.

[Burns]

oh, farming wins off alts is alt-abuse? hmm... intersting... how many of those MRs are actually being played?...

and, victory without loss is not just possible, it's even easy, Battilaa already explained how to do it in the first post

[Liberty4life]

chew not true, if ya get vict it doesnt necessarily means other dude will get defeat

[quote]
# ~~VICTORIOUS~~ (win+1)
This type of outcome happens when both players lose at least 10% vitality and the difference between both oponents is at least 30%. The win gets counted with the win/loss ballance.
# ~~DEFEATED~~ (loss+1)
When the difference between the players is at least 90% and you lose, the lost fight gets counted with the win/loss ballance.
[/quote]

that means range of fights with outcomes from -10% vs 20% till -10% vs 79% (or -79% vs 10%) is always outcome that attacker gets vict and defender will get retreat, which doesnt matter to balance ratio since it doesnt counts

[battilaa]

What works in theory...

after carefull planing i made a 11% - 43% win, truely a great deal of work in this ritual. and behold.. it didnt give me a Victory.

How is that possible?

plz Explain to me. 4-5 hours of wasted work.

(defender was 6trees lvl 4 on martirism)

and just a few fight before i got a Victory from 4%-34%

clearly the system is not working as it is supposed. Im calling for an explanation here. as Balancing fights is an importan side of the game.


anyone?

Edited January 12, 2010 by battilaa

[Nex]

those screenshots simply show 2 sword balance. without the associated battles from your fightlog (which shows if the battles counted for profile wins/losses by checking the according boxes) there's not much we can tell from them.

Edited January 12, 2010 by Nex

[awiiya]

And I quote

"when both players lose at least 10% vitality "

You lost only 4 %, and therefore did not get a victory.

You might want to try lifestealers. They often work better for gaining victories easily. A single being has been known to do wonders.

Awi

[Udgard]

awii, if I read correctly, he said he did get a vic on a 4%-34% fight, but not from a 11%-43% one, which is the opposite of how it should've worked.

[battilaa]

Ok sorry, my bad. My understanding was that if you get a "Sword" then you get victory, and if you get a "Sword Balance" then you just get a Won fight. This is not the case. After rewieving the above fights, i relized it worked fine. (11-43 case sad Won fight counts incremented, looser doesnt get a lost fight.) I could have just spammed my ritual against the 6 lvl 4 Trees, ang get Victories, without the defender getting Losses. For now, my test are over, and let the community decide if such a place should exist. I bow my head before the will of the Veterans. That said, i will be asking anybody i know to plz set up a defence for me with Trees, becouse i want to get my Profile balanced.

Edited January 12, 2010 by battilaa

[Chewett]

If you really want to do this, start it, set up a location and start giving people victories, there are many people who need victories

However if you are going to listen to a load of stupid veterans, then you surely dont want it that bad. If you want something, Do it! There will be people who will follow.

[Shadowseeker]

Well, as long as the movement gets people following, vet or not, it'll survive. That's the best proof if you have support or not, but it wouldn't work that well if you can only run this off alts..well, it would be semi-illegal.

[battilaa]

A working Setup (Tested, and Foolproof) is the following:
Defender:
6 Trees on Martirism/ 0% Personal VE
Reason:Trees are good becouse they have Regeneration, and never seem to run out of VE Becouse of that. They boost each others Regen too, so thats why there are 6 of them. LVL 4-5 or 5 are fine, but for a Standartized System it should be LVL 5.
All Attacker Rituals need to be Personalized, YOU have to figure out what Ritual will make you give a Victory at the lowest loss for the Defender. That would be a (11%-42%) Battle.
For me many Different Strategies Worked. For exemple is used
-1 Maxed Bird
-2 Maxed Water Damion
-3 Kantor War Master
-4 Tree lvl 5 Martirism
-5 Tree lvl 5 Martirism
-6 1 Maxed Looreroot Archer (From Scout)

At 100% Personal VE this gave me a Perfect 11%-43% Win, With Victory to me, and NO LOSS to Defender.
(Sidenote: This was against 6 LVL 4! Trees)

But becouse everyone has different stats, the attacking Ritual will be different from Person to Person.
It requires quite some knowlege to set up the good ritual, but it also makes you learn.

It works without Alt-s, without useing Bursts, every fight involves actualy Attaking and not just retreating with 0-0. And it chalanges players to learn about the fighting system.

For me this seems to be in every way in the Spirit of the Game.

I will be making an Effort to set up this place, becouse testing has showed, that if anything its more REAL then the Burst farming at GGG, more Balanced then getting smoked by tokened Drachs at GOE, and much much more rewarding then beating on Idles at DOJO. Its fun to try to set up the Ritual you need, and more often then not it will fail:) Thing will go haywire and you will be forced to adopt. Have fun!

[Shadowseeker]

Well, if you can make people bother to look out for stats/fighting and the mechanics I'd partially encourage it if you don't post too many spoilers here please.

Seems fine so far, since vics were always officially announced etc. Still, I find it interesting that nobody says much..because I'm sure the vets know how to vic farm, if they bother to spend the time.

There's several ways, and one is what you suggested: I prefer using my creatures (No not drachs) to farm vics up. Perhaps you'll find it as well one day, or have found it already but not put to use.

[Nex]

i think the issue with your idea was this:
you tested a methode for yourself and learned something about mechanics that way. nice.
what you suggest is making a place that obsoletes the necessity for others to learn this themself, giving them a standardized form (as done in your last post) and let them farm without having to understand what exactly they are doing.


i started this post with "i think the issue..." because me saying this without any such prefix would be hypocrisy. my point is that while most of us like to help and are free to give infos we had to work for, we have to keep in mind that giving away too much isn't really helping but destroying the fun of finding it yourself.

since farming profile losses can already be done (actively) at ggg [b]if you know what you are doing[/b], without messing with the regular training, i'd have to say i agree with the general sentiment of a special place not being necessary.