Make Land Loyalty decrease AP only for citizens

[Passant the Weak]

Hello,

After a bit of time experiencing the viscosity system, along with the land loyalty bonus, I'm fairly convinced that Land loyalty should be counted only for current citizens of the land, when it comes to calculate AP needed to move from one place to another.

Currently you get the loyalty bonus for any land you have been member of in the past. That does not sound right to me.

I know some people think differently, but this is how I see things:
- you get an AP bonus because the land recognizes you as loyal to it and becasue yourself have accumulated days as citizens that make you familiar to the land
- if you leave the land, it considers you have chosen another land to love and it does not grant you the AP bonus anymore (however your loyalty still exists somewhere, just does not grant you teh AP bonus)
- if you come back to the land eventually, your AP bonus is re-activated.

I know some peope of the east claim they are still loyal to their former land, but to me they are not different from other people who change their citizenship: one day theywere offered to join Mur's troops orstay in their orginal land. they have made their choice.

Feel free to contradict me! That won't change my mind though, and I'dloveto see that suggestion implemented.

[Chewett]

I like it, but i can bet some pretty Big vets will complain since they are in other lands just so that they can get some faster travel. And will more than likely present some long winded reason why they "should" wheras the only reason would be greed.


It would be interesting to see Mur's viewpoint, Because personally iv trodden around necro more than most (having has access to it for a long long time) Yet clearly that doesn't give me any bonus Land bonus which seems fine.


But if viscosity is meant to be "memory" of treading that land, perhaps another bonus should be based on amount of times visiting that location personally? Generally Viscosity will lower the AP requirement if lots of people visit said location, But even if few visits it, but regularly, surely they should receive some kind of bonus.

The East can take days to navigate without items and Necro is now near impossible. Hence why people are using gaining other lands loyalty, not because they are loyal, but because they want a viscosity boost. I wonder if mur intended

[xrieg]

[url="http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/10748-ap-bonus-for-number-of-visit-in-location/"]http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/10748-ap-bonus-for-number-of-visit-in-location/[/url]
... poll showed that number of visits affecting AP was considered bad idea by most. curret loyalty based system for me makes not much sense

[Esmaralda]

I agree with Passant. I feel that if you leave a land to join another you are no longer loyal to that land. You left, afterall. This will also have the pleasant side-effect of limiting the powers of the few that abuse the system and have loyalty in all lands now, thus freely walking everywhere. There is no way one person can be loyal to two masters, let alone multiple. There is a conflict of interest there.

[Caggie]

I know I don't have much experience with MD yet, but for what it's worth, I think this is a fantastic Idea.

Reason: A LOT of people go through New York City every day, but that doesn't mean that I, a man who has never been there, would be able to find my way around any faster. However, If I was FROM that region and I am one of the people that traverse the streets every day, I WILL be able to find my way around quicker; Not because of the volume of people there with me, but because of my long term stay there and my familiarity of the land as a result.

[Pipstickz]

I'm still just as loyal to Necrovion as I was the day I left it. Tribunal is different, though. Since Granos is pretty much inactive and I'm not a TK anymore, I have no official affiliation and no alliance to join there, but I still want to help. I may never join a Tribunal alliance again, if I can't somehow get SoS back, doesn't mean I'm any less loyal. If demon king Mur told me to jump, I'd still ask how high.

How do you measure real loyalty to a land, though? Is it loyalty to the king? Because the only king is Mur in the Tribunal, and he doesn't ask for much. Alliance leaders? Those are determined by loyalty score, which really comes down whoever can farm it best. It's clearly not the amount of days you've been a citizen, but that's a part of it. All this really boils down to is who should get the AP bonus, I guess, so I s'pose it doesn't matter all that much. Iunno.

[AmberRune]

I think the current way works.

Some people move a lot while others stay in the places where they grew up. When you move to a new place, you don't automatically lose your sense of direction of the places you were before. Works in life, should work here. Also, I don't think places remember people. People remember places.

Maybe calling it something other then "loyalty" (like "recognition" since it works with both showing that you're part of the land and that you should know your way around there better than someone who isn't from there) would make more sense with how I see it, but that's how it looks to me.

[Chewett]

So how does people going into other lands just for the land AP bonus fall into that view AmberRune? They are not part of the land, and just want the AP bonus

[AmberRune]

They could be moving. Foreign exchanges tend to take at least a month (they take about 3 months for my school, a bit longer for some of the other ones that friends go to) and people seem to get to know wherever they stay during that time. Maybe even "visiting" since 1-10 days (like a trip or vacation) doesn't help as much as staying for a month or so but lots of vacations somewhere can help you get to know a place.

Or they're trying xrieg's idea in a way that they can -since visits aren't taken into account but days in the lands are. Or I'm completely wrong since I haven't gone off and asked people who have jumped around what they're up to and if they are trusted by the citizens who've been there longer.

It was a way that I could understand why to people move around and connect to why people would do it in the game.

[Pipstickz]

[quote name='Chewett' timestamp='1325378477' post='99255']
So how does people going into other lands just for the land AP bonus fall into that view AmberRune? They are not part of the land, and just want the AP bonus
[/quote]
How many times has this actually happened? Is it not the responsibility of land leaders to weed out and know these people?

[Passant the Weak]

Amber, I would agree with you ifthe bonus was based on visits madein the land. But that was discussed elsewhere as xrieg pointed out. Here, it is the citizenship that grants the bonus, which to me means the land recognizes you. loyalty is probably inaproprate word, yet it makes a bit of sense. you could always find a good real live analogy to translate that "loyalty". For example, as a citizen, you get used to (and recognized by) the bureaucracy in the land, which allows you to travel easier. When you lose citizenship, the bureaucracy knows it and makes you feel it

Pip, my suggestion stands even with no people "forcing" the way to several citizenships. Even for loyal people who change their citizenship in their MD life, I believe the bonus should be granted only to their current land. That's why i suggest an ingame mechanism.

[Chewett]

[quote name='Pipstickz' timestamp='1325383572' post='99258']
How many times has this actually happened? Is it not the responsibility of land leaders to weed out and know these people?
[/quote]

Have you seen what Grido and Peace are doing? They may be friends, but i still disagree with it.

[Jubaris]

I'm ok with the concept that you can use land loyalty to decrease viscosity even if you aren't citizen of that land (but you were before), but, the problem is that those that are very loyal to their homelands and don't want to temporary join other ones to gain some traveling advantages suffer.

Perhaps there should be some bonuses for "very loyal" people. Some kind of proportional increase of stats in fights when they fight in their homelands?

[Pipstickz]

Grido and Peace aren't joining the lands, they're using illusions, and illusions aren't real, they should not offer real bonuses. That doesn't mean loyalty needs to be changed, it means the illusions need to be changed.