Brainstorming And Listing Possible Game Concept

[Liberty4life]

for some time already i was planning to start workin on game of mine own, bit by bit at a time, i have some general concept in mind already, it will be kind of strategy/rpg, not yet sure will it be mmo or single player game, that point i will decide on course of development, questionable is to make it real time or turn based, then if its real time wot should happen if two things happen at same time which should effect each other, to give one of them priority, to execute both or to make them block each other, thats wots bothering me from game type aspect

since i want it to be very realistic game with some bits of fantasy, there wont be races, player is human, but there will be cultures, nations and other aspects that will make impact on type of player, i also dont like idea of making classes, each player should get freedom to improve itself in any aspect of game, things that are in other games limited by class and level system i plan to limit by various other requirements, so it would look similar like "feats" system in nvn, but... not sure on wot should i base all of it, i must say that i dislike idea of stats, but since i cant think of any other way.. it will be complex stat system, how you advance your char it will affect your status and job abilities, etc for example veteran sailor will very unlikely be in same time best woodcuter in country, so how ya advance your char ya change many other things in progress and hopefully advance much further, buy more land, improve your home, hire others to work for you and many other things, so in other words ya are getting more power, and more power ya have more ya control, if ya get up to status of village ya can control all in it, and if ya go even further... who knows wot can happen, thing is unlike other rpg games this one as i said i want it to be more realistic, means less fights, more work, ofc ya can be warrior of sort, but merchant will be far more powerful, merchants with theirs wealth can get to positions of power much faster, but that doesnt means that thief cant brake in kill guards and merchant

on macro strategical view, game will be pretty large, big land, with many nations, resource scale would be big, if someone played stronghold then he knows that it had many resources, big economical concept, and ofc all sorts of defensive stuff to use, but this is not all, there will be way of improvement in tech, if ya have people in your land that can pull it off, why not be more advanced than your neighboar, let him invade ya with swords and then ya wipe him off with cannon the game will change a lot over time, it would be like empire earth tech wise, but tech advancement wont be achieved by spending res but by having capable people which can hit high req in specific field

now since ya got small sneak peek i ask ya to do for me few things and/or answer some questions

at which historical point should game start from?
make a list of possible stats player should have that arent related to anything except mind and body (good example: physical strenght, stamina; bad example: attack, defense)
make list of resources
make list of possible jobs
make list of possible feats/abilities
make list of useful items that will be produced (just general names no variations please becoz players ingame will be able to make variations of items during production of them)

have any other idea that could fit in? or want to add possible requirements for harvesting of each resource or uses for res, how to get better at some job, ideas of specific item production, how feats can affect each other, how stats can be used or something else is on your mind feel free to discuss

generally... i am most interested in getting huge lists stats, feats, jobs, res and item classes

2 best contributors will get wp

[Kafuuka]

Being skeptical: do you know how to program in a decent language, ie c++? If you don't go into the multithreading route, events will never be simultaneous for your program, so you shouldn't worry about it. The scope of your plans is also very large rpg/strategy with the extent of d&d/empire earth?

Might be helpful: play dwarffortress for a while, it has a very extensive economy with jobs, items and resources. (And look at how long it's being developed already.) Puzzle Pirates also has a good way of managing supply and demand issues and keeping the player economy going, although the puzzles are very repetitive, but you're not aiming for puzzles.

[Yoshi]

I just have to point out that your asking people to give YOU ideas for YOUR game, on a forum dedicated to a DIFFERENT game... something's not right about that.

[Chewett]

[quote name='Yoshi' date='19 November 2009 - 04:48 AM' timestamp='1258606081' post='47875']
I just have to point out that your asking people to give YOU ideas for YOUR game, on a forum dedicated to a DIFFERENT game... something's not right about that.
[/quote]

If you wish i can resurrect the "new and original ideas" forum so it can be there?

I cant remember where it went but im sure its somewhere.

[Grido]

Yeah, Mur commented a while back now, that if anyone knew of new or original games that he didnt mind us promoting them, and would seem like this would fit with that.

[Liberty4life]

nice advice kafuuka, no idk c++ but believe it or not threading can be "done" with php for example
yes i plan to use idea of advancement through ages "like empire earth has it" but there actually wont be ages, there will be technologies, so technologies will speak for themselves, for example if nation can build aircraft then it aint in medieval age no?
yup i will use some elements from d&d, although for example.. in fights there wont be stuff like hp or damage, if ya manage to cut opponents head... well its over for him

PS looks like dwarffortress doesnt likes nix so i wont try it

[Kafuuka]

With php? That sounds very insane to me. It's all Turing complete but then again, you're not going to program it in abacus or lolcode either methinks.

Dwarffortress runs with wine too, if you're using linux.

[Aeoshattr]

ZOMFG ppl, contribute!!!
i, personally, have my own idea of an RPG (MMO AND single player - no, idk if that can be done, but it will - and no, don't tell me it can't be done, let me dream on)so, ideas for your game:
Start: Obviously the present (lol). And that present should be, IMHO, for th sake of the game after a major event in your world's history. let's say rebuilding after an invasion, i dunno.
Stats: Phisyque (hope i spelled it right), Mental Acuity , Endurance (thinking of more) Charisma, Interpretation (hehe, twisting what the other says is always fun XD)
Resources: well you said you want it fantasy, so i'll put the usual ones (wood, stone, metal, food) and another 3 that are related to your game's world. Since i have no idea what you have in mind, i can't give an example.
Jobs: Merchant, Hunter, Mistic (again, i hope i spelled it right), Prior (unh... priest / prophet stuff) jeweler, woodcutter, blacksmith, artist, scribe, soldier, etc (brainstorming here XD)
Feats / abilities: wish i could help you there m8, but i dunno if i can give the type of abilities you're looking for. Maybe something like a trait system, in which you can gain various bonuses for you and your followers.
Items: (this one's hard, needs more thinking)

(will edit post later, thinking bout it)

[Totenkopf]

[quote name='Liberty4life' date='18 November 2009 - 10:53 PM' timestamp='1258577636' post='47846']
now since ya got small sneak peek i ask ya to do for me few things and/or answer some questions

at which historical point should game start from?[/quote]
it depends a lot on whether it's single-player or mmo - but i'll go with the assumption it's a mmo - if it's mmo, it would be unfair to new players to start in the bronze age and go up against guys with nuclear weapons, sort of like mp3s going against mp5 in MD As such you need to either have a kind of separation as in MD, or have set time periods for each "round" with everyone starting off at zero, and possibly multiple servers running in parallel once the game gets off the ground and there's demand for it.
an interesting idea would be to start off in an early period and have initially only a hunter/gatherer choice, from which multiple other paths or "job" posibilities might emerge as the society advances

[quote]make a list of possible stats player should have that arent related to anything except mind and body (good example: physical strenght, stamina; bad example: attack, defense)
make list of resources
make list of possible jobs
make list of possible feats/abilities
make list of useful items that will be produced (just general names no variations please becoz players ingame will be able to make variations of items during production of them)

have any other idea that could fit in? or want to add possible requirements for harvesting of each resource or uses for res, how to get better at some job, ideas of specific item production, how feats can affect each other, how stats can be used or something else is on your mind feel free to discuss

[/quote]
again, i would start off with a few stats, which may increase in complexity as the game advances - for example you could start with strength, social skills and intelligence - and let's say inteligence could further divide into creativity (which would lead to something like an artist job) and theory (which could lead to inventing theoretical concepts like maths and so on) and application (which would create actual devices out of the theoretical concepts), and maybe combinations of these would lead to diferrent paths. Social skills could include something like trade sense or negotiation which could help merchants, oratory/politics which would lead to political careers/leadership (and may influence relations with subjects) and social interaction which could help in various things such as finding mates, teaching etc. And strength would split maybe into actual physical strength, stamina, hunting prowess (which with intelligence could evolve into tactics, strategy etc.)

feats and abilities should integrate into most of the jobs, being more effective for some and less effective for others - e.g. understanding maths would help mostly researchers but to some extent merchants and even gatherers at an early stage.

resources required should differ and evolve as well as society advances, in the beginning they would need just water and food (maybe wild game from hunters and fruit from gatherers), but should evolve based on need, e.g. at some point they need more wood for fire then later stone for buildings and so on.

Edited November 19, 2009 by Totenkopf

[Liberty4life]

yeah some of ya understood some points i made.. so i will go to explain more

if game starts at bronze age.. and ppl make it advance further.. lets say to modern age, new player continues in modern age, its not individual advancement, its overall advancement, becoz irl.. ya are born while others are in modern age.. ya dont live in cave with stone age tech lol

fantasy aspect of game.. will be very slim and undocumented, it will do very minor effect to overall game but still it will be there, ya act as if whole game is 100% realistic

yes basic skills would be something similar like that as totenkopf said... but for jobs like leadership of somethin or artist or poet... there wont be stats ya will have to show off your work to other players, or trade which is also social thing.. basic skills will be capped, becoz no matter how much ya train irl ya cant keep running full 24h, unused stats will get dropped over time, there will be stats that will be related to item usage and jobs, which will be shown in percentage.. if ya are woodcuter and go to builder job.. your skill with hammer will start increasing and your building skill, while ya will start losing your woodcuting and axe skills, those skills wont drop drastically.. but it will drop enough so ya arent as proficient in your ex job as ya used to be and there will be some kind of "skill memory" if ya get back to that job.. your skill in that job will get back to point where it once was MUCH faster

yes abilities/feats are very job related and technological relationship exists, it takes to be expert in specific field and posses specific knowledge to perform it...

all kind of resources will always exist, but at early point there wont be need for most, also at later stage... for productions i might put that they will need to use already processed resources.., but since improving of quality of resource.. is just a middle man work with no specific use i will most likely remove it.. for example wool.. if middle man processes wool and makes it washed and combed wool.. well still next destination is textile factory.. no other option to send it to, so i will skip that part and say that factory itself does that part of job

[AqlBeast]

[b]at which historical point should game start from?
[/b]Probably sometime after caveman era when the technology hasn't been developed. Enables you to tutorial the player on how to play the game and then advance into another era.

[b]make a list of possible stats player should have that arent related to anything except mind and body (good example: physical strenght, stamina; bad example: attack, defense)
[/b]Body: strength, stamina, energy, agressiveness, passiveness
Mind: karma, intelligence, skill, communication

[b]make list of resources
[/b]tree (different kinds)
clay/stone
water
iron
silver
gold
crude oil
human

[b]make list of possible jobs
[/b]peasant, farmer, carpenter, builder, artisan, thief, guard, captain, dealer, merchant, lord, nurse, doctor, factory workers

[b]make list of possible feats/abilities
[/b]planting, harvesting, communicating, researching, building, guarding, stealing, killing, refining resources

[b]make list of useful items that will be produced (just general names no variations please becoz players ingame will be able to make variations of items during production of them)[/b]wood, food, explosiver powder, flour, stones, iron, silver, gold, population, house

[][][]Thats about it for me. Good luck your game.

[Burns]

however complex and goodlooking that thing is on the large scale, for the single player, it's damn specialized and pretty boring, ain't it?

like, would they be any more than an ant-like humanoid in Age of Empires? One that loops through his job until he dies, strictly speaking? XD


you can't keep them attached with competitions, either, casue each competition will favor the one who is the most specialized, aka spent the most time doing repetition.
I mean, look at some GameForge games, there's some pretty high complexity in them, but once you are 'in the game', it's repeating the same things over and over again until you are top of whatever you want to be top of...

So, i think what you need to get in is not more specialization and repetition, but some sort of uniqueness to keep things appealing for people, like unique quests (meaning, things that happen ONCE) every now and then, and which don't consist of buttonmashing or 24/7-playing, but need people to work together to achieve a solution, like Shadowseekers quest during festival of pain.

To make them stay between those events, which could be monthly or every second month, you will want to have some sort of combat-thingie so players can fight with each other, which doesn't necessarily mean beating each other up, but maybe challenging someonein their groups along 'who can gain more ressources in a given time', 'who can produce more carrots', 'who can reach antarctica first'-lines, or also in a more global context 'who can earn more coins with whatever ability they have or haven't'...

about ressources, jobs, abilities and such, they are covered, but that wouldn't be anywhere near a game that would make people stick around...
unless you plan to have it very short scaled along the lines of starcraft, but that would put you under the pressure of competing with starcraft =P

[Udgard]

Questions please. Will the player be a one-man army, or will he be the commander type while his army does most of the work. I'm gettin the impression that it's the first, but just to make sure..

[Liberty4life]

well ya are one char... ya do everythin on your own.. and interact with others, ya will earn money if ya manage to sell something to other players, not to system, if ya get support of player to lead nation.. nice if nation is at war those same players who chosen leader.. mainly ones that are fighters.. will have to defend it, leader will order stuff around... would ppl do as he says? idk up to them

thing which burns stated, required fire to keep interest.. well i hope that will achieve big scale of things available connected with politics, player who wants higher social position ingame will have to earn it from others, to get theirs support to lead nation, region, village, wot ever, it will be up to leaders how much dynamical it all would be, politics will make many things possible or impossible, and well all sort of things to do will make it quite challenging, ya will pick wot ya think is best, and maybe change it later due to change of situation, oke so i will compare it with gameforge's bitefight, ya put your char on work to dig graves for 8h, he have done work all fine ya got money all fine, now ya can be attacked and robbed and ya can get back to work and do it again all the time, in mine game however... ya can send your dude to chop some trees, then sell wood on local market by local prices, interesting stuff is.. there can be any price, there can be theif that will pickpoceket ya after selling wood, there can be thief that will stole your axe from your home, there can be jerk that will burn your home and eventually get caught and hanged, there can in sudden moment in your place appear many new woodcuters and price for your product can became too low for ya so ya might want to move somewhere else, change your job, or many things, thing is as long as player is success at his current place he will stay doin it, becoz he knows he is good at it, and if he is good at it... he can grow, he can make guild few ppl cut wood, few are carpenters, few are sailors, so they can trade in more places, he can achieve better social status in his local community, maybe he can invent new tech that will improve woodcutting like circular saw, there will be tons of options while in bitefight ya dont have those rich options, ya are either vampire or werewolf and thats damn it, 2 types of chars to interact/play with and both have same concept

[Burns]

but breaking it down to the single player (who supposedly has no secret lives as another player), it's still a quite repetetive action, make something and sell it... or steal things and avoid getting caught XD

the social ranking thing sounds like a great concept, yeah, but how many leaders can a village afford? and how many people will stay in the slums for all the time they play, working for a lord who's in that position because he started earlier, or invests more time? i don't think the low classes will buy that concept, specially if moving upwards is a long and stony way...

if the framework is set in a way that will make constant changes necessary, though, it might keep people active and interested for a very long time, like if warfaring nations can conquer half the known world (mind you, half the world, not all the world) and make their own 'race' leaders of others, and the woodcutter could be head of some plantage or something after participating in the war, or lose it all and turn to a slave with realistic chances of revolution, or flee to another country and build a new life... that's where things get interesting... complicated, yeah, but interesting

thing is you'd need to make sure that waging war pays, which is pretty tough if you want to keep things realistic, cause seriously, world reaches a point when war doesn't expand, but diminish economic options...
if you could shut globalization down for your system it would be a lot less realistic, but might give incentive for your politics to do things that influence the everyday gameplay, like protectionism, slavery, wars and all that stuff...

and you need to give the little people ways of secret communication (which can be systematically spied on if a leader knows how to, but only in pieces and what-not) and realistic chances of revolutions to happen, not have them fight well-paid snipers with a tri-fork like most 'historically correct' games do...

[Liberty4life]

exactly that will be possible, leaders will need to have support from theirs citizens to stay up there, and yup in wars, anything can happen, take another country reward your soldiers by giving them foreign land and slaves, why not, revolutions why not if ya manage to outsmart occupators and get some weapons so that ya can have chances... fleeing is always possible, but how much effort will be needed for those things... ofc that falls down to how good conqueror took care of possible revolution

for now dont torture me with that aspect of game, first to make "normal" stuff functional, later will be work on political stuff system, and spying... well that is delicated part of game... it will be needed much much more for something else rather than leader spying on his own ppl, and that would be to find enemy guy that is workin on discovering some new deadly tech, ya dont want him have it before ya, or if he gets it, why wouldnt ya have it as well