Illusions and Alliance status

[Esmaralda]

The illusion is a cover, a ruse, a way to conceal your identity and become someone else.That's good and fun, but the way it is currently designed, you get to fool everyone all of the time. Once in an illusion, not even the alliance leader who should technically hold the scrolls of all the members of the alliance knows who you are anymore. If you get kicked, it's as if the fake person gets kicked, but he doesn't erase the name of the real person from the list.

No one should be fooled all of the time. That is simply not realistic.

It could be interesting to add some intrigue to be able to fool some of the people some of the time (and perhaps it could include alliance members or even the leaders as well). Perhaps you were able to sneak in at night and re-write your name to Bob, and then Bob gets kicked in your stead. But there [b]has [/b]to be some chance added to it that you fail. Currently, there is no chance whatsoever that you would fail. You absolutely always fool all the people all the time, for as long as time as you wish, and there is nothing anyone can do to ensure that you don't regain your status once you choose that the illusion is over.

That to me is too powerful for a spell and changes have to be done to it.

[Prince Marvolo]

I want to explain my thoughts about this, in a manner that I hope will make sense.


I see the illusions, as a dam that broke, water is flooding out, and we are on the wrong side of the dam.
People on the right side of the dam, tell us to swim up towards the dam, through the rushing water, and get to dry land. Telling us it’s possible to get up there.

Swimming makes you survive, yes. And swimming up a river is doable, and will teach you things.
But swimming up a flood, is insanity.
And when you almost reach that dam, someone will just open another little hole, to make us flush away back to where we started.


While some people tell us to swim, for it is a way to beat water, I would suggest fixing the dam.
I think that is the more constructive way to deal with the problem.



I know I will always have people disagreeing with this. There will always be people upon that dam.
But illusions should be a cloak, not a tank to make you practically invulnerable.

[Rendril]

When you become an illusion you become someone else. When you turn back, the memories of who you were will be used to put you back (like your alliance). Some of the ordeals you take as an illusion are remembered and they leave scars on your original self.

It is possible to mimic your previous self in an illusion, like being in the same alliance. When you get kicked it is not your actual self that gets kicked.

As for this particular case the issue I see is the amount of time being spent as an illusion, those actions can catch up to you.

[Prince Marvolo]

So basically, what you are saying, is

"Yes it is a tank, deal with it and learn to swim"

[Rendril]

No, just be creative.

[lone wolf pup]

What would have happened if all the seats were taken and she tried joining in?

[Chewett]

Im betting it would still put her in the alliance. Intresting idea to test though.

[Liberty4life]

or maybe ya would be unable to fill all seats while she in illusion

[Jubaris]

Rendril, you explain that alliance seat is a part of identity, meaning that you could gain any alliance by combining the core alliance identity with yours, but reality tells us that it is something material that can be controlled by its leader via "buttons", history tells us of alliances that were destroyed despite their identity being preserved...

Double standards, or "we'll figure out along the way"?

Edited January 22, 2012 by Rhaegar Targaryen

[Rendril]

Ask yourself: why is it that the leader of an alliance is determined based on loyalty instead of being an elected representative? Answer that and and I believe you will understand why the leader has "buttons".

How then can an alliance be destroyed? Well...can it, really?

[Jubaris]

It can't, in the context that you're applying, but I'm pointing out that this "identity" emergency button is not used for all cases, actually, it is rarely used, only in few cases it was used, while in most of others, "cold brute force" of take over was not putted anywhere near discussion table.

What sense does it have when you apply it "only sometime"? I'm kinda sick of isolated cases...

Edit: just to add that I don't really care much about the Shattered Illusions thing, my concern is about the implementation of the law.

Edited January 22, 2012 by Rhaegar Targaryen

[Udgard]

[quote name='Shemhazaj' timestamp='1327147637' post='101603']

[color=#808080][i]she got kicked out twice Chewett.[/i][/color]
[color=#808080][i]first time, yeah, she gained loyalty after dropping the illusion, after being kicked out second time (Illias managed to do that when she was almost catching up with him) she gained loyalty outside the alliance and knew exactly she'd be back in...[/i][/color]
[/quote]
Wait.. so people can gain loyalty when in illusion mode? If yes, I think that's what should actually be fixed.
If you are reset to your conditions from pre-illusion when you come out of it, loyalty gained during illusion mode should be reset as well.
[quote name='lone wolf pup' timestamp='1327235630' post='101819']
What would have happened if all the seats were taken and she tried joining in?
[/quote]
Or more interestingly, what would happen if the alliance was disbanded when someone tries joining it..

[Grido]

[quote name='Udgard' timestamp='1327381157' post='102085']Wait.. so people can gain loyalty when in illusion mode? If yes, I think that's what should actually be fixed.
If you are reset to your conditions from pre-illusion when you come out of it, loyalty gained during illusion mode should be reset as well.[/quote]This got fixed, used to be possible, not any longer - regardless of illusion


[quote name='Udgard' timestamp='1327381157' post='102085']Or more interestingly, what would happen if the alliance was disbanded when someone tries joining it..[/quote]If there are invites pending, and everyone has left it, then the invites would still be valid. If an illusion is active whilst they're in an alliance, and everyone is kicked, on cancelation of the illu, they'll be back in the alliance.