Access to restricted areas in wp shop

[Nimrodel]

So I was thinking, maybe people should be able to get access to restricted land areas (ones not in the wp shop atm) coupled with a certain loyalty requirement. For example: 1 wp + 600 gg loyalty for access to storm coast. Or 1 wp + 600 loreroot loyalty for pathkeeper etc.

[No one]

As long as it is deeper within the shop.

Otherwise those would be the first to be used ... i think.

[Syrian]

As long as it is deeper within the shop.

Otherwise those would be the first to be used ... i think.

5+ would be reasonable

[Sunfire]

 

Ann. 3423 Priority: 2 [2015-04-12 21:51:44 - Stage 12]

Special Land Scenes
Certain scenes are special to the land and there is very limited access to visit them. Access will only be given for exceptionally important work and with approval from the land in question. The leader/s of the land will always be asked before access to this type of scenes are given. They will also not be have their access given for WP's or similar. We may review these scenes and de-restrict them in the future after discussion with the land leader if we decide that they should be made public and used.

While story mode changes are ongoing we may open up some scenes or add certain (previously story mode only) access to the WP shop but anyone getting individual access to these scenes will have to get approval from the land first. If any land leaders wish to discuss this please come talk to me.

Some scenes which fall under this, but are not limited to, Angiens Ferry, Pathkeeper, Inner GG scenes, Inner Necro scenes

[Nimrodel]

 

 

Ann. 3423 Priority: 2 [2015-04-12 21:51:44 - Stage 12]

Special Land Scenes
Certain scenes are special to the land and there is very limited access to visit them. Access will only be given for exceptionally important work and with approval from the land in question. The leader/s of the land will always be asked before access to this type of scenes are given. They will also not be have their access given for WP's or similar. We may review these scenes and de-restrict them in the future after discussion with the land leader if we decide that they should be made public and used.

While story mode changes are ongoing we may open up some scenes or add certain (previously story mode only) access to the WP shop but anyone getting individual access to these scenes will have to get approval from the land first. If any land leaders wish to discuss this please come talk to me.

Some scenes which fall under this, but are not limited to, Angiens Ferry, Pathkeeper, Inner GG scenes, Inner Necro scenes

 

 

 

Yeah thats why loyalty was included in the picture. And i agree with keeping it inside the shop. i'd say 10+ wp.

[AmberRune]

That could be a bit weird in the wp shop. I mean, it would be nice to see that there are options available but if the shop kept telling me that there were available purchases but that I'd never be able to get them, I wouldn't want to keep seeing them.

 

Custom wishing for them would make more sense since they would need to be approved anyway.

[Nimrodel]

Custom wishing takes lots of time. And special occasions. Wishpoint shop wishing is easier to access. Its not like its an abusable wish. Also, if you want to custom get them, you can do that as well. No one said that wishpoint shop items are not custom wishable. Also, they are not never gettable. You need to pay a certain price for them. But hey... you need to pay a price for everything thats rare and precious. :P

[AmberRune]

Time, yes but it doesn't necessarily take a special event anymore with https://magicduel.com/page/Announcement/view/3517

 

 

But if your idea appeared in the wp shop saying that it took a wp + X amount of land loyalty, then there would be stuff that appeared in the shop that people would not get for being part of other lands.

[Nimrodel]

Time, yes but it doesn't necessarily take a special event anymore with https://magicduel.com/page/Announcement/view/3517

 

 

But if your idea appeared in the wp shop saying that it took a wp + X amount of land loyalty, then there would be stuff that appeared in the shop that people would not get for being part of other lands.

 

Sure.. But if you wanted that stuff, you could always change lands and get the required loyalty. Thats the 'price' you'll be needing to pay for a special wish. Also, you need to stay in the land that much time to deserve access to one of its special areas. Getting it in a custom wish when you arent even a part of that land for a single day, sounds rather unfair. Doesnt it? For example, if you've spent your entire game time in GG and want access to a Necro secret areas through a custom favour... thats very unfair to the necros who have been actually a part of the land for a longer time and dont have access to the area. Loyalty requirement makes it compulsory for one to be 'loyal' to that land for the required period.

[Ivorak]

 

Sure.. But if you wanted that stuff, you could always change lands and get the required loyalty. Thats the 'price' you'll be needing to pay for a special wish. Also, you need to stay in the land that much time to deserve access to one of its special areas. Getting it in a custom wish when you arent even a part of that land for a single day, sounds rather unfair. Doesnt it? For example, if you've spent your entire game time in GG and want access to a Necro secret areas through a custom favour... thats very unfair to the necros who have been actually a part of the land for a longer time and dont have access to the area. Loyalty requirement makes it compulsory for one to be 'loyal' to that land for the required period.

 

 

Some things to think about:

 

1) Are we encouraging people to change lands more frequently then? I always thought most players frowned upon this.

 

2) I feel that either the access to restricted locations matters very much (in which case land loyalty should not be a measure) or not (wishpoint, but not the active day requirements). 

 

3) There are several ways to do "custom" wishes. 

    A) A wishpoint, plus approval of some power such as Mur, Chewett, the land leader, alliance heads, etc. One of the above, two of the above, whatever...

    B) A sliding scale from 1 wishpoint with approval of land leader, to X wishpoints for no-questions asked grant

    C) Something like the above, but on a case by case basis, instead of preannounced requirements

    D) 1 wishpoint with X land loyalty, or X wishpoints without requisite land loyalty

 

4) Should land loyalty be considered by the citizenry of the land (influencing things like how the leadership distributes alliance roles, stock from land treasuries, etcetera), the land itself (lower AP costs, access to different locations, other influences), or both? This is tricky. The land does already to a degree and the citizenry does too, but often less so then the land itself (which makes sense because land loyalty only measures the presence of activity per day, not its overall magnitude), but if the land is in some sense separate than its people, then perhaps there needs to be other ways to gain land loyalty than the three step process of 1) being granted citizenship, 2) avoid being excommunicated, and 3) logging in each day.

[AmberRune]

I don't think the deserving and wishing aren't exactly in the same zone. I want access to locations and worked for the wish points to try and gain something I actually wanted. No, there is no special land tie there but does that mean I still shouldn't be able to get something I truly want? I will pretty much never be a Loreroot citizen but if I'm willing to shell out 3+ wishpoints, all at once mind you, for the option to get to the Pathkeeper, shouldn't it be just as valid a desire and show of being deserving as if I wanted to gain access to the Sunny Bedroom since I'm an easterner or access to the House of Tainted times from back when I was a Necro for the same prices?

 

The work for winning multiple wishpoints isn't anything to scoff at either. You pay a good amount of time, stress, and/or headache for each one. Some people seem to get them easier than others but work still needs to be put in for wish points to come out. Along with a fair amount of self control to save multiple for the access if there are still options in the shop that you would actually consider getting that cost less.

[Chewett]

>if I'm willing to shell out 3+ wishpoints, all at once mind you, for the option to get to the Pathkeeper,

Send Mur and email for a custom wish if you want it :)

[Nimrodel]

 

 

Some things to think about:

 

1) Are we encouraging people to change lands more frequently then? I always thought most players frowned upon this.

 

2) I feel that either the access to restricted locations matters very much (in which case land loyalty should not be a measure) or not (wishpoint, but not the active day requirements). 

 

3) There are several ways to do "custom" wishes. 

    A) A wishpoint, plus approval of some power such as Mur, Chewett, the land leader, alliance heads, etc. One of the above, two of the above, whatever...

    B) A sliding scale from 1 wishpoint with approval of land leader, to X wishpoints for no-questions asked grant

    C) Something like the above, but on a case by case basis, instead of preannounced requirements

    D) 1 wishpoint with X land loyalty, or X wishpoints without requisite land loyalty

 

4) Should land loyalty be considered by the citizenry of the land (influencing things like how the leadership distributes alliance roles, stock from land treasuries, etcetera), the land itself (lower AP costs, access to different locations, other influences), or both? This is tricky. The land does already to a degree and the citizenry does too, but often less so then the land itself (which makes sense because land loyalty only measures the presence of activity per day, not its overall magnitude), but if the land is in some sense separate than its people, then perhaps there needs to be other ways to gain land loyalty than the three step process of 1) being granted citizenship, 2) avoid being excommunicated, and 3) logging in each day.

1) No ones encouraging. As I mentioned, its a PRICE you have to pay. 

2) You have a player who has been a part of the land for two whole years, that isnt enough for you to call them a citizen? 2 years is a lot of time in MD. And a wishpoint is like you are wishing for access and proof that you have involved yourself in MD atleast some part of time. With the wish being in 10+ cat of WP sop, it definitely means you have involved yourself in the game too. Its not easy to get 10+ WPs. Not in this current Era at least.

3) a) Lets assume That I have a tiff with my land leader who doesnt like me getting access to a hidden location. Does it mean I am not loyal enough to my land? Chewy or Mur bypassing a land leader in such a situation would sound like meddling in internal affairs. Would definitely hurt the ego of a land leader. IF something like this is in the WP shop, the thought process would generally favour towards acceptance. 

b) see a)

c) see a) and others.

d) Whats the difference wit it being in a WP shop and People asking separately if Loyalty is in the rewarding criteria anyway?

4) If the time you have spent in game couts for citizeship voting, or collecting land items, surely loyalty must be important? Doesnt it make sense? You spend a terrible amount of time in a place, you should know your way around in that place. The way I see it, The three ways you mentioned of gaining land loyalty is good enough? 1) shows you have a rapport with the people/leader, same goes for two. 3) shows that you have painstakingly logged on to MD every single day for 2 years. And 10+ wps shows that you have involved yourself in the game pretty deeply. (i hate repeating my POV again and again :P)

 

 

I don't think the deserving and wishing aren't exactly in the same zone. I want access to locations and worked for the wish points to try and gain something I actually wanted. No, there is no special land tie there but does that mean I still shouldn't be able to get something I truly want? I will pretty much never be a Loreroot citizen but if I'm willing to shell out 3+ wishpoints, all at once mind you, for the option to get to the Pathkeeper, shouldn't it be just as valid a desire and show of being deserving as if I wanted to gain access to the Sunny Bedroom since I'm an easterner or access to the House of Tainted times from back when I was a Necro for the same prices?

 

The work for winning multiple wishpoints isn't anything to scoff at either. You pay a good amount of time, stress, and/or headache for each one. Some people seem to get them easier than others but work still needs to be put in for wish points to come out. Along with a fair amount of self control to save multiple for the access if there are still options in the shop that you would actually consider getting that cost less.

 

Yes you do pay a lot of time for multiple wishpoints, but you dont pay enough time being a part of the land. ITs like, a foriegner is requesting access into the deepest areas a city just because he has brownie points with the higher authorities. 

 

Pathkeeper is an important place for the lorerootians. I doubt they'd like it if access was granted to someone from the East who has spent absolutely no time in Loreroot when people who have been a part of loreroot from a long log time havent gotten it. Its just not fair if a higher authority bypasses that because in such matters opinion of the people counts too.

[Ivorak]

You haven't addressed some of my questions (which is fine, because they were addressed to everyone and are more a list of "things to consider" than "this is how you should think about this issue"). Though you've probably answered them (I see all that text there :P ) but I don't understand what you're saying exactly.

 

In 4) I distinguished between the land and the people of the land. Someone might be admitted to Necrovion citizenship because they're friends with some other Necrovians, but the land should still be able to reject them in some sense (I see lands in MD as self-aware in some sense, especially Necrovion with the shades). This implies that the land should also be able to accept someone who the people do not.

 

But yes, I think these wishes are good, even with the land loyalty requirement. Just let's not rule against other possible ways to gain access.

[Chewett]

If people want access to specific locations for WP's they can send Mur and I a custom wish.

I approve of the idea in principle, in practice you would need to discuss the requires for specific locations and get their approval.