MR's Training Grounds

[Burns]

1. What makes you think i refer to MP5 only?
Yeah, sure, I love killing things on MP5, but it's not like i couldn't be avoided, drop your ally and get to 200+ losses and you're safe from me.
What i rather refer to is MP3 and MP4, where people start to either like or leave MD.
Almost all the players who get to MP5 at all are alts. MP3 can't find a target, and when they find out about GGG, they realize that 'training' is a cooperation-thingie here, meaning, you can't keep up with somebody who spends more time in MD, which results in: They are unable to win against anybody who started before they did.
Fine game to play...

2. Mkay, a reminder for those who know less than Chewie, who obviously posted to make me explain...
People complained that they were unable to find opponents back in the days because we all were massively off balance, which lead to massive free stats for us, and a lot of frustration for balance-players, in the end. Right, maybe not the nicest thing to do, but either way, Mur stopped us.
The situation with GGG is literally the same:
-There are no opponents for a fight, just like the trees back then.
-There's massive stat gain via various means, mostly high-honor and saccing with a high ammount of wins.
-There's that massive, very very massive, distortion in low MPs, something we managed to avoid back then, as i might add.
-And, last but not least, it's very frustrating for very new players, whereas willow's was only frustrating for new MP5 who were balanced.

3. Even Pip knows how to not get his creatures killed regardless of the incoming attack. Even Pip! (Sorry Pip, may the Fetish be with you^^)

4. Do i really need to go into the details of how long you have to stat-grind 24/7 to beat somebody who knows how to fight? Because, you know, there's something far more important than stats, we mostly call it 'ritual'... I've been doing that Fight Club thingie a lot lately, when i set a decent rit, i need no more than 1% of my influence to win almost all the time, and even that is only for regening the crits after some token-monster bashed my def. That's how useful stats are.

PS: I have yet to see the GGG send me a fighter. I almost beat up Chewie's HC-defence with 5 remains and an angien, and the second time i tried i suceeded with a new rit of 5 remains and an angien on a different targeting-option. Yeah, the GGG definitely does a lot to improve the overall quality of the duels in MD...

Reading a second time, i think i might have to elaborate on 2 even more.
The problem with Willow's, in a very generalized way, was that there was a mutual agreement of setting trees and giving losses to everybody else at some point because that was the way everybody gained most. Which ended in frustrated newcomers who got -600 honor for a win, and massively increased stats for the people who spent the most time online.
This was not really a problem in itself, but it messed with the balance concept.
GGG messes with all concepts:
People don't get to balance in GGG because they couldn't use it anymore due to honor issues, unless they used honor-alts, which is not allowed.
People don't DUEL, last time i checked part of the title of MD, but merely sit and look at each other until the fight is over and they get their wins, xp and stats (which they do, don't worry about me being wrong, i'm not).
AND, you exclude the people who don't wish to play by your rules.
And now tell me how that situation is different from the one at Willow's which lead to skilldamage, except for me being on the other side this time.

[Firsanthalas]

You do realise that you are defeating your own argument?

[Chewett]

[quote name='Burns' date='20 May 2010 - 09:32 AM' timestamp='1274344368' post='60094']
PS: I have yet to see the GGG send me a fighter. I almost beat up Chewie's HC-defence with 5 remains and an angien, and the second time i tried i suceeded with a new rit of 5 remains and an angien on a different targeting-option. Yeah, the GGG definitely does a lot to improve the overall quality of the duels in MD...
[/quote]

i sit at GGG most of the time im online, but im actually too busy to actively train, So what you actually were going against in the HC was me with a slight help from GGG. Also, you proved yourself that you, with one angien, easily killed me setting up a pretty decent ritual. There is no point me trying to kill you since you have masses of tokens and stats to match. Its why i dont bother with fighting since its just SO broken. So well done for easily killing me, But then again ANYONE who has been at mp5 for a couple of weeks can kill me.

[quote name='Burns' date='20 May 2010 - 09:32 AM' timestamp='1274344368' post='60094']
And now tell me how that situation is different from the one at Willow's which lead to skilldamage, except for me being on the other side this time.
[/quote]

I see a large difference. Considering that stats will not help you AT ALL against most people, and as you said you in your main point that people at GGG dont learn to make rituals, I dont see why are so concerned the fact they are NOT getting better. You dont complain about people who are running around attacking everyone they see because there are better ways to train?

Why make the point that people at GGG dont learn, and the fact that stats dont matter, And then continue to moan against it?

Are you not allowed to make your training as convoluted as possible?

[Burns]

Because i [u]don't[/u] want masses of brainless zombies, and specially not masses of brainless zombies that put off the few thinkers who still come around!
If you want to start a character these days, there's NOTHING but GGG to train anything at all, am i actually the only person to think that anybody with brains doesn't see much of an interesting game in that?

[phantasm]

*looks at his diploma(S), different academic achievements, letters of excellence, and hand crafted furniture he made. Then makes a brainless zombie face* All hail the GGG.....All Hail the GGG......

[Burns]

So far so good, we've had our fun... Even when you didn't pick up on all the punchlines i offered xD
Can we go on to the actual message now?

Just in case you didn't notice, it'd be those parts:
[quote]Almost all the players who get to MP5 at all are alts. MP3 can't find a target, and when they find out about GGG, they realize that 'training' is a cooperation-thingie here, meaning, you can't keep up with somebody who spends more time in MD, which results in: They are unable to win against anybody who started before they did.
Fine game to play...[/quote]
[quote]-There's massive stat gain via various means, mostly high-honor and saccing with a high ammount of wins.
-There's that massive, very very massive, distortion in low MPs.
-And, last but not least, it's very frustrating for very new players.[/quote]
[quote]People don't get to balance in GGG because they couldn't use it anymore due to honor issues, unless they used honor-alts, which is not allowed.
People don't DUEL, last time i checked part of the title of MD, but merely sit and look at each other until the fight is over and they get their wins, xp and stats (which they do, don't worry about me being wrong, i'm not).
AND, you exclude the people who don't wish to play by your rules.
[/quote]

And just because i don't feel like joking around right now, i'll add that that's what i actually fear happening.
Not that only the brainless survive MP3, but that a lot of potential is lost on MP3 because the general appearance doesn't imply that you can get further if you are smarter, but that you can only go beyond average by investing more time than the rest... which is not really possible for a newbie in a game that doesn't reset.
I repeat, there's no joke in this post, i actually mean it.

[Pipstickz]

I would like to add that I saw an MP4 at GGG yesterday asking if there was a way to get EXP without actually fighting. In other words, he was asking if he could get EXP from GGG duels. Is that not at least mildly disturbing?

[Darigan]

So let me see if I have this straight, you want people to get away from the ggg, learn the mechanics of the game, learn how to set better and proper rituals, and then what? I keep hearing you and others talk about how stats and tokens are useless or at least that they don't help much, and yet today I spent part of my time fighting against you and only ever did 1 damage with maxed grassens because my defense is to low...well how do I raise up my defense, by saccing crits that raise defense, but how do i train crits to high enough level where they make a decent defense sac certainly not by fighting anyone that sits at the GoE you all are in a league of your own with fully tokened drachs, which I'll admit that the only problem with your rits today Burns was that I was better off with you attacking me then the vice versa at least then I didn't lose xp just some vitality. Oh and if you think the reason I'm so weak is because I spent all my time up at ggg it's not because until I got to mp5 I was rarely ever there I didn't need to be there since I didn't need to worry about all the other mp3's and mp4's having drachs and upgraded angiens to rip me to shreds. Worst person I had to worry about was Yoshi and he rarely ever attacked me.

This argument can go on for ages because there are several different opinions on both sides of the issue...I for one am split because I don't like the idea that people hide away at the ggg nor the idea of MP3s ending up there. I don't like it anymore then you do Burns but on the other hand I can understand why so many are there. The fighting system has flaws on both sides. Whether they want to admit it or not, some people are overpowered. Others are severally underpowered because they lack the stats and knowledge to compete against the rest. I suggest a place for ritual training where the willing veterans can teach ones that want to learn through dueling how best to set rituals and the all important game mechanics you keep going on about. If you want smart competition sometimes the best way to get it is to teach, otherwise by all means go on and complain about how brainless people are and do nothing else about it.

Edited May 21, 2010 by Darigan

[Pipstickz]

[quote name='Darigan' date='20 May 2010 - 07:26 PM' timestamp='1274405217' post='60144']
I suggest a place for ritual training where the willing veterans can teach ones that want to learn through dueling how best to set rituals and the all important game mechanics you keep going on about. If you want smart competition sometimes the best way to get it is to teach, otherwise by all means go on and complain about how brainless people are and do nothing else about it.
[/quote]
Hence, Burns' fight club.

[phantasm]

coming from pip, who rarely ever has a rit on that doesn't have 2 minutes of token scrolling before his fight.

[Yoshi]

[quote name='Darigan' date='20 May 2010 - 09:26 PM' timestamp='1274405217' post='60144']
Worst person I had to worry about was Yoshi and he rarely ever attacked me.
[/quote]


I have to say, I almost fell off the couch laughing when I read that

But, I think the problem is that MP5's are not capped. In any game where people have levels, there are always the ones that have maxed levels. Like, take Runescape. All the skills are capped at 99, cept the new dungeoneering skill which is now 120... anyways... once you get to that point, that's the top of the ladder. In this way, no one can surpass anyone in terms of skill level, but in the equipment they use, the skill of switching weapons at the exact times, etc.

In MD, MP5's just keep getting larger and larger stats. The new MP5's are not even close, so there's a huge gap inbetween the MP5's. This COULD be solved if perhaps MP5 got split somehow. This might stop lowly MP5's from using the GGG in fear of the "top dogs".

[Pipstickz]

[quote name='Pipstickz' date='20 May 2010 - 10:15 PM' timestamp='1274415344' post='60151']
Hence, Burns' fight club.
[/quote]


[quote name='phantasm' date='21 May 2010 - 08:11 AM' timestamp='1274451070' post='60172']
coming from pip, who rarely ever has a rit on that doesn't have 2 minutes of token scrolling before his fight.
[/quote]
What does the fight club have to do with tokens?