New Archer Abilities

[AqlBeast]

@Mur: Level 5 Archer (the one that use to target all but not max) still has no target.

[Ilias]

i still think a new creature would have been a lot better

then messing with one that was working pretty well from the start

and new creatures is always a plus
due to its fun seeing new things , more cool artwork
and nice to be able to obtain more different unique pets

---//./:__-
also get more , and i mean seriously better neat avatars
like hire whoever made uhm king bulls , peace' s avatars

whoever that was did an awesome job

[Jubaris]

just tested the drain ... ITS AWESOME!!! heheheh
it does damage as well which i didnt knew

[Chad]

Based on my observations, I dicovered these things:

(Before the bug fix)
For example: An attacker has 70k Syntropy, his opponent has 10k Syntropy, they both have the same rit of Archers draining that Principle, whatever the outcome of the battle is, it will total their targeted Principle and will divide it to two, hence giving them both 40k VE. It doesn't matter who lose or wins, but you can say that the player with most Principle targeted will lose some or most of his Principle, of course, the Principle gained is based on the player's ritual and initiative, I'm just not sure if defense affects the drain.

(Battle Log)
A's Heretic Archer does drainelementelor to random creature(s) of B and:
Applying temporary effects for B, slot 4 : , weaken (round:3 weaken: defence=-82 )
- Drain power: 8.2637% ( tried for 0.17% )
**- Permanently draining: 752.597 Element Principle (8354.663 left).**
**- Draining 75260 vitality from Elemental I creature DIES!**

To this I say, 8% of B's Element Principle was drained by the Archers of A that doesn't have or low Element Principle, 8% of it is 752.597 Element Principle. The VE damage is the drained Principle multiplied by 100 will give B 75,260 (75,597 rounded off to the nearest 10th's) Vitality damage, much like the Angiens but more strategic.

These are just based on my observation about the new test for the Archers, I haven't tried it yet after the percentage was fixed.

Edited November 5, 2009 by Chad

[dst]

So..you want to see what the new ability does?
2 examples:

Dark Archer II does draintimpului to random creature(s) of xxxx and:
- TAINTED! Defender has lower Time Principle, attacker LOSES principle points!
- Drain power: 1.9571429% ( tried for 9.82% )
- Permanently losing: 1545.212 Time Principle ( left). and remains with 3425 vitality
Chaos Archer does draintimpului to all creature(s) of xxxx and:
- Drain power: 280.007% ( tried for 7.92% )
- Permanently draining: 437817.99 Time Principle (-281458.33 left).
- Draining 43781799 vitality from Dark Archer II creature DIES!


And from principles w****** (yes, MB's favorite word some time ago regarding stats ) look where you can go if you know who to fight:


Rustgold Madhorn does haoticdamage to all creature(s) of xxxx and:
- hits haoticaly and does 1606691 damage to Elemental V creature DIES!

- hits haoticaly and does 784667 damage to Grasan Huvourer creature DIES!
- hits haoticaly and does 1602427 damage to Imperial Aramor Assassin creature DIES!
- hits haoticaly and does 1219246 damage to Rustgold Drachorn Hatchling creature DIES!
- hits haoticaly and does 1587078 damage to Drachorn
creature DIES!
- hits haoticaly and does 1053448 damage to Kishani creature DIES!

[AqlBeast]

Wow I am amazed. Hope that isn't your principle that is losing dst.

[AqlBeast]

Hahha wow

[apophys]

I confirm that the level 5 archer (Dark Archer III) still has no tagrets.


[quote name='dst' date='05 November 2009 - 07:10 PM' timestamp='1257444610' post='46726']
- Drain power: 280.007% ( tried for 7.92% )
- Permanently draining: 437817.99 Time Principle (-281458.33 left).
[/quote]

280%?... Did it synthesize nonexistent charge?

Anyway, Mur announced he fixed this to max at 2%. Is this before or after that?

[AqlBeast]

Probably before.

Also lvl 5 archer was verified before as well.

[Chad]

[quote]Dark Archer II does draintimpului to random creature(s) of xxxx and:
- TAINTED! Defender has lower Time Principle, attacker LOSES principle points!
- Drain power: 1.9571429% ( tried for 9.82% )
- Permanently losing: 1545.212 Time Principle ( left). and remains with 3425 vitality
Chaos Archer does draintimpului to all creature(s) of xxxx and:
- Drain power: 280.007% ( tried for 7.92% )
- Permanently draining: 437817.99 Time Principle (-281458.33 left).
- Draining 43781799 vitality from Dark Archer II creature DIES!
[/quote]

That's what I meant dst.

[Jubaris]

testing the abilities, it seems you will only gain (like gain at your profile after the duel) principle, not if you drain it from the opponent, but if opponent tries to drain a principle from you and he has the higher principle (tainted thing...)

is this a bug or is meant like this to be, that the attacking creature can't gain principle (only use it to damage opponent's principle and VE)

[baiano]

[quote name='Malaikat Maut' date='04 November 2009 - 02:42 PM' timestamp='1257356571' post='46613']
Double post...

The ratio is definitely not 1:1 and there is actually a "leak". I've recorded our total principle values below. The result of the first attack was near balance, although he lost 8 and I gained ~13. Since then some value has merely vanished. Don't know if it's supposed to operate that way or not...we've gone from ~95.39 total to 92.39.

Start
Aster - 58.xx
Mala - 37.39

Mala attack 1
Aster - 50.86
Mala - 50.73

Aster Attack 1
Aster - 50.86
Mala - 47.24

Mala Attack 2
Aster - 46.25
Mala - 46.14

Edit:

Another round...
Aster Attack 2
Aster - 43.55
Mala - 43.61

We lost a combined total of ~6 principle points.


I think ...the archer´s and another creatures needs too have new abilities yes...but like alternative abilities not only ...like archer has normal atacks and principles drain atack.....will better.... and it will alloy every one to make more and more atrategy....
[/quote]

[Elthen Airis]

It seems everyone is enjoying the new abilities. I don't really fancy them, but that's a matter of opinion. Anyway, if they stay, which i reckon has a good chance of happening, is it possible that they actually give something except principles when sacrificed. All of the upgraded creatures improve stats when sacrificed. I don't see the reason, the archer should be an exception. Since they use power now, i guess they should give power as a sacrificial reward. If there is a reason for them not to have such a value please share it with me, i would like to know.

Opinions on the matter are appreciated.

[Death Bell]

[quote name='Elthen Airis' date='08 November 2009 - 04:12 AM' timestamp='1257633754' post='46914']
It seems everyone is enjoying the new abilities. I don't really fancy them, but that's a matter of opinion. Anyway, if they stay, which i reckon has a good chance of happening, is it possible that they actually give something except principles when sacrificed. All of the upgraded creatures improve stats when sacrificed. I don't see the reason, the archer should be an exception. Since they use power now, i guess they should give power as a sacrificial reward. If there is a reason for them not to have such a value please share it with me, i would like to know.

Opinions on the matter are appreciated.
[/quote]
Well maybe the archers should be giving the normal att/def stats because People spent hours and days training these archers with so so many wins on them. So if you change the reward stats to power stats only. You are gonna have alot of pissed off players in here.

[Burns]

there have been several times already when pretty hard work was annihilated with new rules, people will eventually learn to do things in other ways, and will have to put up with the fact that their training was for naught, and seriously, if they can't cope with that, i'm not even sorry to see them packing their bags...

[Pipstickz]

It's like heads contest: Unfair

[Death Bell]

well it easy for you to say that when you haven't trained like that... but i know people who have collected 5k wins on there archers each.. and you might think you don't mind if these players leave. But don't forget they are also humans and humans tent to take revenge when they are pissed off. What if they start bad mouthing MD in public forums and stuff. we are losing.
just my 2 cents.. i wasn't talking about any people particularly.
but to be honest, i don't mind no more stats rewards for archers (i got only like 1k win on them so i don't think i have the right to say that) i am just worried about people who have given more time for this.

[dst]

You cannot please everyone. Not to mention that having 5k wins on archers is pure grinding. Shall I remember you all that grinders are not welcomed in MD? I have been told that every single occasion. So they will not be listened. Not to mention that some of the changes related to crits/combat are consequences of grinding. Or they are punitive measures (like the skill damage).

[Elthen Airis]

[quote name='Death Bell' date='08 November 2009 - 05:18 AM' timestamp='1257653937' post='46926']
Well maybe the archers should be giving the normal att/def stats because People spent hours and days training these archers with so so many wins on them. So if you change the reward stats to power stats only. You are gonna have alot of pissed off players in here.
[/quote]

It's not about having people pissed off or not. The new archers update is implemented at the moment and if it doesn't change, we should all be rather creative to get familiar with it. I said it should be power, because it's the most common association, since now they use power for their attacks. That still stays on Mur's shoulders as a decision. But i still don't see a reason why not to have a stat value when sacrificed.

[quote name='dst' date='08 November 2009 - 12:43 PM' timestamp='1257680581' post='46936']
You cannot please everyone. Not to mention that having 5k wins on archers is pure grinding. Shall I remember you all that grinders are not welcomed in MD? I have been told that every single occasion. So they will not be listened. Not to mention that some of the changes related to crits/combat are consequences of grinding. Or they are punitive measures (like the skill damage).
[/quote]

It's better to go and buy some tokens right?

I cannot agree that grinding is not to be welcomed. It's a matter of preference in my opinion. Everyone chooses himself how he will improve his stats. And greater stats ARE needed. And in fact, what is the GGG made for?

Edited November 8, 2009 by Elthen Airis

[dst]

@Elthen:tokens without principles are useless. And to get tons of principles you need to grind. So basically we are talking about the same thing.
I would love to go back to the times when only stats mattered in combat but things changed and I had to adapt.

Oh...one last thing:read this in case you think I am against grinding.
http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/3867-flame-the-grinders-corner-formarly-interview-with-a-grinder/page__hl__grinder__fromsearch__1

[Elthen Airis]

[quote]Oh...one last thing:read this in case you think I am against grinding.
http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/3867-flame-the-grinders-corner-formarly-interview-with-a-grinder/page__hl__grinder__fromsearch__1
[/quote]

Ah, so you do share my opinion. *smiles*

[baiano]

[size="4"]Level 5 archer doesn't have a target.[/size][font="Arial Black"][/font]

[Neno Veliki]

while creature with this ability is needed to balance principals or whatever the reason for creating that ability is, i dont think the archer is the right creat for that. one thing is that archer is basic creature that is used a lot by new players and with this change new players lost perfectly good damage/weaken creature.
draining ability is interesting at higher mp levels where the principal stats are bigger but at low mp this kind of ability has really low effect.
so maybe the better choice would be to create a new creature with that ability or giving that ability to some other more suitable not basic creature (for example unholy priest, drain ability suits him better than it suits archer by my oppinion) and leave the archers as they were.
if anyone asks me i would prefer the "new creature in the realm" scenario the best..

[baiano]

i beliave in the same Neno Veliki...changing basic cretures will make dificuld the begin of new players.....

New cretures with this abilities is better or give the archer this abilit but put new basic cretures for new players....



"And the dark archer V does not have a target....."

[dst]

@baiano: writing every 3 posts that the archer has no targets it will not solve the issue. All it will do is probaby make me delete some of your posts as spam.