Remove Item Owners List

[Chewett]

After much debate on the item owners topic it seems that people think others are hoarding the items to be on the item owners list.

And as the only Hoarder who spoke, IAB said that he keeps it not for the list, So surely they wont mind if it will be removed

It will mean that people wont just get items so they can appear on the list.

What do you guys think? Im not entirely sure this will fix any problems, but i am merely wondering if people think it should be removed to aid the problem.

[Aeoshattr]

well so far that's the only 'item browsing' service. so if you'll remove it, trading will pretty much die as you won't have any means to view all (well at least lots) of items in one place. i personally don't want to run around all over the place to see what items people have.

maybe it would be a better idea to arrange the item owners by name rather than by the number of items they have. i don't know, or make an alphabetic list of items with their current owners' names.

[Czez]

Can't we have a list of Items rather than owners?

[Peace]

I would say no to this. Having a list of item owners at least indicates us who could possibly have an item one needs, although that still does not guarantee that the saying person will get the item in the end. It saves a lot of time from searching both the item and its owner.

Just my two cents here.

[Chewett]

Hmm, very good point, but surely thats the fun of RP and such? you wouldnt be able to see automatically who has what items, you would have to move around, looking for your item.

[Kafuuka]

Removing the owner list is one step in the right direction. It won't solve monopoly problems, yet solving the monopoly problem but keeping the list would also be insuficient.

[quote name='Aeoshattr' date='07 February 2010 - 06:11 PM' timestamp='1265562700' post='53991']
well so far that's the only 'item browsing' service. so if you'll remove it, trading will pretty much die as you won't have any means to view all (well at least lots) of items in one place. i personally don't want to run around all over the place to see what items people have.
[/quote]
The majority of people currently in the list are not willing to trade (for prices people consider fair). Removing the list will make it more difficult to find the person who owns what you want but at the same time more likely that person will trade with you.

If you want to browse items in order to decide which you want, you are doing it wrong. There is a way to earn a custom made item which suits your character, so if your character really needs a certain item that's a very good way to get it. If you are checking item by item whether you want it, you're bound to desire dozens of items and are going to be very disappoined. The ratio of items versus active players is probably less than two...


@Darkpriestess: the list isn't complete, It is possible to know with certainty that an item exists if you have seen it, but if you have not seen it, you cannot say it doesn't exist.

[Rendril]

There is no list of "creature owners", yet there are many ways to find the creatures you seek.
I believe a near-complete catalogue of what items exist (and for some of them, the owners will still be the same) could be assembled from the lists we made for Udgard's quest (if he hasn't already done so) so a rough idea could be given of what items are avaiable.
Not to mention, a player's items are visible when viewing their arena/doc page, this in fact means they can't lie about having an item.

The forum has a market section for a reason, one could easily post that they are looking for a certain kind of item, or putting some item up for trade/sale.

Having a list of item owners is nice, but in effect it just makes people want to be on top, which is not necessarily a bad thing, until we are faced with a situation of hoarding resulting from it. Yet if there must be a list, it might as well be ordered by ID or player name, remove the ranking incentive of hoarding which although it migth not prevent it, it might not encouage it as much. I like having the list, but if it causes people to try achieve a high score by suc han utterly unimpressive means, perhaps it is better to be without it.


The items however, do belong to the hoarders and they are fully entitled to hoarde them and charge exorbitant prices as they see fit. Whether it has a negative effect on MD is a different matter. Afterall, we could have holograms instead of televisions right now, but are held beck because of the very greed exhibited by the hoarders.

[Udgard]

I'd vote yes.
I think instead of listing people and items they own, it might be better to make an item search function. You input the name of the item you wish to find, and the search function lists all people who own that particular item. Of course, to search, you need to know that it exists first (as in, knowing its name).

I can release the catalogue I got from the last quest, if the community wishes so.

[Aeoshattr]

[quote name='Kafuuka' date='07 February 2010 - 08:38 PM' timestamp='1265567934' post='53996']
Removing the owner list is one step in the right direction. It won't solve monopoly problems, yet solving the monopoly problem but keeping the list would also be insuficient.


The majority of people currently in the list are not willing to trade (for prices people consider fair). Removing the list will make it more difficult to find the person who owns what you want but at the same time more likely that person will trade with you.

If you want to browse items in order to decide which you want, you are doing it wrong. There is a way to earn a custom made item which suits your character, so if your character really needs a certain item that's a very good way to get it. If you are checking item by item whether you want it, you're bound to desire dozens of items and are going to be very disappoined. The ratio of items versus active players is probably less than two...

[/quote]


And what about resources, the items needed for crafting? don't you have to 'browse' for those?

[Rendril]

[quote name='Aeoshattr' date='08 February 2010 - 08:45 AM' timestamp='1265611550' post='54057']
And what about resources, the items needed for crafting? don't you have to 'browse' for those?
[/quote]

As I said, post on the forum, ask around, put up fliers, search items pages. The owners list is hardly the only method avaiable for finding items, it is handy though, but due to extortionate prices, it might as well not be there since nothing gets sold as a result.

I can add an mdscript to some clickables that serves the fucntion of an advertising board if someone wants it.

Edited February 8, 2010 by Rendril

[Yrthilian]

I voted no.

The list does in a way serve what it is intended for.
The issue with removing that list is it makes it harder to find items
yes i know there are other ways too.

But hiding the list just help people horde the items more. But the issue is
not with the list or the displaying of it. It is the fact the items are being
horded or being sold and completely stupid and unreasonable pricing.

This in its self does not encourage trading as who really wants to spend 30/40 silver
for an item to get a mundane item created for it. I know this argument has been
had many times on the forum.

But i still stand by the keeping of the item list.
It is the people with the items that is the issue and not the list.

[Pipstickz]

Yrth, you say the point to keeping the list is to track hoarders (tracking items themselves can be done in many other ways, and it also pointless if all you see is the hoarder's items), but what's the point of tracking them? What can anyone do about it, except for Mur?

[Kriskah Arcanu]

Deffinitly the eliminationg of the list won't solve the hoarding situation. People have hoarded even before the list existed.
If it is really Mur's intention to prevent this to happen Im sure he will come with a most effective idea to solve this "problem".

[Kamisha]

My proposal is simple instead of removing the item owners list it would be better to replace it by simply replacing it with a refined system. This system would have the ability to search items by typing in a name of a item. The items would then pop up based on that key word search. The other option would be a drop down box that would show the items. When either of these options are used the owners of the considered item would be displayed below. This would limit the hording as being on the list would only occur when somebody is looking for a item that you possess as well as trading I suspect will actually improve as not only the high item holders are contacted but the people with the correct items are contacted.

Seeing what is already in use on MD this doesn't seem particularly different to program.

I would like anybody who does not find this as an except able approach to challenge it within reason and modify it in order to remove any problems.

[dst]

I voted yes because I know for a fact that few of the players in the top 10 keep the items specially for that purpose.
If you need an item you'll find it if the character is active. If the character is not active what good it will do to know he/she has it but you cannot get it cause he/she quite some time ago?

Edited February 13, 2010 by dst

[Amoran Kalamanira Kol]

I think that at the moment the Item Owners list causes more harm than good, however I do see the potential in keeping such a list in the side menu. It may work better if it were organized and set up in a different way, but at the moment with the way it is currently I do not see a reason in keeping the list around.

If the market for items were constantly in circulation and constantly moving I could see the potential in it.. but for now it sits in the side menu and has no general purpose because the market is somewhat slow when it comes to items. I do see hoarding of items, most often to get to the top of the list, and this boosts reputation/ego and.. at the moment it just isn't a good thing because.. truthfully, what is the point in items if they are nothing more than trophies?

I voted yes, it should be removed.

Edited February 13, 2010 by Amoran Kalamanira Kol

[Mya Celestia]

[color="#8B0000"][font="Palatino Linotype"]I voted yes to remove the list. Some of the items that people have go with their character and they aren't necessarily horders. Others the list is almost like bragging rights.

Maybe an item search function would be better than a list. Often people wander and check each player they come by looking for something specific because that person may only have one item. [/font][/color]

[Orlando Gardiner]

I think it should not be removed. merely because people love to abuse systems shoulden't mean it has to change all the time. Thereby, this is still a good and easy way to search for items you need.

[whitewater]

As an Item owner I did not realise there was so much fuss over it.
I have my items due to an rp I do ingame and they go with my character, to call me a hoarder smacks of jealousy to me.
Rarely do I look at the item list as it makes no real differnce to me, especially as Items have no real value ingame. Or are they and I am missing a trick?
I see them as a gift for being active ingame, not as a status symbol, so by all means remove the list of it makes you uncomfortable to see what you don't have.
Or alternatively have an opt out option for item owners, then complain that the people still in the list are just showing off..............

[phantasm]

whitewater they are not talking about those with an item or two. The main discussion about it is those who "horde" raw materials to have a high position on items owner list. To make them more "popular" though it often has the opposite effect. I myself have been trying to acquire wood planks for some time to create an item. Most with such an item want an item in return so they can "stay at the top of the list" and have openly admitted to it. These are the people that this is targeting more then those who have earned their items.

I myself had to quest for weeks, use a wish point, and work very hard for my most prized item, a piece of important roleplay to me. Quite a few anymore items just "appear" in their inventory for good RP. While I think that's a good thing, many of us older members of the community had to get items the hard way. It is many of those people, including myself, who frown upon the hording of raw materials just to have a spot on the list.

[Udgard]

Whitewater, just to clarify, the topic is about [b]raw material[/b] item hoarders, not the personal items you got from RP (from Mur). The raw materials were given for free during the festival of pain just for being there, and people frown at those who hoard it because then the raw materials cannot be used as intended - as materials to create a flow of items.

[whitewater]

[quote name='Udgard' date='15 February 2010 - 10:22 AM' timestamp='1266229332' post='54521']
Whitewater, just to clarify, the topic is about [b]raw material[/b] item hoarders, not the personal items you got from RP (from Mur). The raw materials were given for free during the festival of pain just for being there, and people frown at those who hoard it because then the raw materials cannot be used as intended - as materials to create a flow of items.
[/quote]
Ahh, I see.......Ok, would it not be easier to just call em materials and dont have them show up on a list? and perhaps a time limit before they dissapear? that would encourage trade.
And -5 rep points for my post? I must have touched a nerve........

Edited February 15, 2010 by whitewater

[Sharazhad]

[color="#2e8b57"][i]Most of my points have been mentioned before, I think that the list should be removed and that a search function be used instead.  It would eliminate the need to go hunting for items especially if the user has one or two items on their list. [/i][/color]

[color="#2e8b57"][i]Hoarding items will still be around , however if the list is removed then the need to be seen on the side panel would be decreased somewhat.  [/i][/color]