LHOs debate

[Grido]

@Sparr, personally i don't like the insinuation that LHOs are such for personal benefit, and to assume that a non-LHO player does it for no benefit, is, to say the least, silly (nothing against you Tarq), players do like gaining adepts you know? But then that is my opinion, and you have yours.


EDIT: removed the MD Awards list, cos no reason for it to be in this bit.
Also, for clarity, as Amoran asked about it, the reference to Tarq is purely that Sparr nominated him, i stated "nothing against" him as i didn't want to imply that Tarq was doing it for the reasons (or other) listed.

Edited November 25, 2010 by Grido

[Amoran Kalamanira Kol]

Most of the LHO I have spoken to aren't in it for personal gain, and I'm not entirely sure that's what Sparrhawk meant by his post, I would have to re-read it.

The point is, not everyone in MD is completely selfish, though greed is certainly a highlight in MD.

(Please remove the post below. That was an accident.)

Edited November 25, 2010 by Amoran Kalamanira Kol

[CrazyMike]

Not to be offtopic but I need to respond to what Sparrhawk said about LHO.

I was once a LHO and I helped newbies not because I was LHO, but I became a LHO because I liked helping newbies.

And I believe the same for the current LHOs.

They are LHO because they like to help, not that they have to help because they are LHO.

Sorry for the offtopic.

[Sparrhawk]

I say because as a LHO you should be helping people its something you have signed up for and it isnt as if they are without benefits for doing it and also it isnt like anyone who applies for it can or will be accepted. My point wasnt insunuating they do it for reward if you read closely before bursting out such ludicrous accusations I stated I believe that someone who just helps others just because not because it is their job is someone more deserving ~in my opinion~ I didnt really want some huge rage and debate over itbut if you'd like to open another topic. Another reason I feel is there were the medals given out for LHO's already.

Edited November 25, 2010 by Sparrhawk

[Pipstickz]

The award should be judged on how well the people in question help people, not their position or reason for doing so.

As well, if anyone is "bursting out", it's you, Sparr. Grido is quite polite in his post.

[Sparrhawk]

Perhaps I spoke in haste but I see no need to apologize for it I was offended and found the comment rude.

My initial comment wasnt trying to force a vote of whether or not LHO's should be elligable, I stated a personal opinion in hopes others might see it and think hmm well so and so does x, y , z I might nominate them.

I never at any point said that LHO's do that job for rewards but I am sure that no one is under any illusions that they are compensated for the service they provide.

- spells
- credits
- medal with a incredibly generous reward for some which I can only assume would happen again at some point

It seems like double dipping to me if you get my meaning. They seem to be the most nominated in said section. I wished to provide thought to others who in my opinion are more deserving of said nominations due to the fact they dont help out others because it is a duty they have signed up and been accepted for. Some do it out of pure kindness and that is the sort of person I believe most deserving and the kind of person I nominated.

These are all my cards layed out. You wanted a debate well this is my thoughts and reasoning. I never asked for LHO's to be inneligable if I had wanted that I would have asked for an opinion poll and wrote out all my reasoning, I stated that I personally didnt like it and that opinion wont change I did and remain of the opinion, the LHOs provide a service they are compensated for and some have been accoladed for this service and recieved generous rewards. I do not see why they should also be eligable for doing what there supposed to do ~in my opinion~.

[Grido]

If you found my comment rude, then you might understand that I found yours equally, if not more so. Hence my reply to it.

Now, as for the state of LHOs, you seem to be under the impression that they don't choose to be LHO, because if you were under a different impression, that of them choosing, you might realise that the phrasing of them doing "what they're supposed to do" would be...off.

A player has a choice, that of helping players or playing their merry way (I have no objection to either path, before someone assumes I critique). The player that chooses to help players, then has a secondary choice, to become an LHO, or to not.The players who you refer to nominate/vote for, would fall into the second category (again, no critiquing). The main emphasis, as is likely aware to you, is the matter of choice.

Yes, an LHO gets a few things, as you mention, but I should imagine that if they were doing it for gain, they would want a lot more than they get. The "extremely generous reward" would be the spell to summon me? This is a query, I can't think of anything else that was given at the same time as the medal.

Surely ~because~ they signed up for it, it would show that they would be under the title of "Helper of the year"? In that they want to help a lot, and that they'd actually be strong candidates?
That isn't to exclude others from being nominated, whilst my response to the suggestion was humerus on my part, it's a sensible idea.

For clarity, I didn't ask for a debate (though I do enjoy them, don't get me wrong), I replied to your comment on the thread, and others decided to perpetuate it.

[dst]

Maybe it's time to share my opinion.
I am one of the players that became LHO not because I like to help people. I did it to experience this side of the game. Besides I was already doing the LHO job but at a different level. I was not dealing with new players but with vets. How many of you didn't ask me anything since you started playing? Few. I am sure. Don't get me wrong: I like what I am doing now and I try to do it as good as I can. But it's not what I want to do all my MD life.

Oh...as for rewards. Frankly I almost never use my LHO spells. Credits? 5$ in one year? I get more by voting. Badge? It was implemented after I became LHO. Hmm..yes, maybe the badge is something I consider a reward. But not the others.

[Ravenstrider]

[quote name='dst' timestamp='1290758724' post='73284']
Maybe it's time to share my opinion.
I am one of the players that became LHO not because I like to help people. I did it to experience this side of the game. [/quote]


Totally off topic: I thought you became a LHO to finish Renavoid's quest for the Leadership spell doc... You shatter my illusions.

[dst]

O.o how do you know of that quest?

[Sparrhawk]

I am not under the impression that people do not choose to be an LHO.

You apply to be an LHO you are either accepted or rejected.

If you become one are you not doing so understanding that it is now your duty to provide others with help and if you are not doing so you will be removed from this position?

Correct me if I am wrong.

And to be honest DST it might be only $5 but thats still being given to you for your service regardless of the figure a reward is a reward regardless of how much its worth.

[dst]

If I get the credits do you want them? Cause you seem to make such a big fuss about the 5 dollars that were awarded last year. No idea if that thing will repeat or not! Shish...
Want me to decline the credits? I will gladly do it if all you can see in this whole thing is the rewards LHOs get.

Edited November 26, 2010 by dst

[Mya Celestia]

[color="#8B0000"][font="Palatino Linotype"]When I signed up to be an LHO, it was simply to help people. It wasn't for a medal or credits. It was and still is to help new people fall in love with the world of Magic Duel and experience it to its fullest.[/font][/color]

[Indyra]

i think we're wasting to much time here INSTEAD of helping. Sparr that section is for LHO , it has been like that last year too and it motivates us to give the best . You had the chance to propose a new category of award for non LHO's. You could have done that .

[Darigan]

I believe thats why the reward was renamed helper of the year, and why you and Tarq were nominated Spar. Is the idea of an award that much to fight over who gets it?

[Sparrhawk]

I really dont care who wins I just had a little touch to add to my nomination which was attacked to which I replied hastily adding if Grido wanted a debate to start another topic.

The catagory isnt for LHO only Indyra if it were well imo that would be another kettle of fish.

I never have once said that anyone does it for the things they recieve yet you keep thinking I have said that somewhere.

I am not complaining about 5 credits I dont need or want credits it is the principle of it all which most seem to be having great diffuculty grasping when the concept is laid bare it baffles me.

my opinion and thats all it is my opinion will not change I dont particularaly like it.

There were medals given out for LHO's already I dont see why there should be another one for it. I have never disputed LHO's deserve what they have recieved I just think getting 2 awards for the same thing is just plain poor taste and being awarded for that the way it is named I dont see why doing your duty entitles you to a second helping.

[dst]

Maybe this is not the right place to post it but since we are debating LHOs and their reasons to be LHOs, look at my exchange of PMs with a new guy:

[quote]*From: Blacknights (ID:198423)
*sent 23 minutes and 13 seconds ago Read later
Help request
4 1 2 28

Where is it?
[b]Your reply to this message:[/b]
Go and look for it. [/quote]

Since it's heads I had a hunch and I checked if there is someone hidden in there with heads. And it was.

[quote]*From: Blacknights (ID:198423)
*sent 19 minutes and 9 seconds ago Read later
Original message
any hint ?? the reason why it's un xx place..
[b]Your reply to this message:[/b]
What do you mean by xx place? And I am not going to tell you where it is. If you want the heads PANDAY has, go and look for the place.[/quote]


[quote]RE:RE:RE:RE:Help request
???

wo wo ...

I really dont get it why you are LHO ??

...

hehe quit your job will be better for newbie
[b]Your reply to this message:[/b]
If that is what you expect from an LHO, you're WRONG!! Really really wrong![/quote]

[quote]Help request
I saw your writing in the forum.

I dont like you just like to experience a part of games

not kind of newbies ..

not professional in your job.. .

it's not about you didnt answer ...

I feel insincere from you ..
[b]Your reply to this message:[/b]
No, you're mad cause I did not tell you where the guy with the heads was hiding. And you talk about sincerity? Ha! [/quote]


No comment.

Edited November 28, 2010 by dst

[Blacknights]

I asked to DST about Underland, her alliance

the answer

You'll not find info about the Underground as a land.

Check the forum. There is a dedicated subtopic.

LHO not because I like to help people. I did it to experience this side of the game

I dont like to ask something from Live help as newbie..

I dont know what you expect from forum

you intent to make me negative reputation.

as Veteran user ,LHO you think you are doing good , I dont think so

What you have to know I dont like you, dst...

Edited November 29, 2010 by Blacknights

[dst]

And your point is? (except the part where you don't like me cause that is mutual)

[Indyra]

@Blacknights:

The reason why we become LHO is not for you to debate ( there is a higher power who does that) The questions you ask is not for an LHO to answer. If You don;t like dst you can adress to another LHO , that;s why there is more than one of us. Also you can address to older players , most of them are very helpful even if they are not LHO's. None of the actual LHO's would have answered your question considering the reason behind it. The Fact that you don;t like what she posts in the forum has nothing to do with her in-game actions or with her knowledge. As an LHO our main goal is to help you [b]explore on your own[/b] not give you answers that you can find for yourself.

Indy

[(Zl-eye-f)-nea]

I'm glad to have an LHO like DST, who doesnt just give out any old information. Who can spot someone trying to cheat at heads due to their own ignorance. Who gives a damn. I find this pissy little PM situation from Blacknights really offensive. A new player who tries to trick the system, gets caught and then has a go at the one telling them to stop. This sentance "hehe quit your job will be better for newbie" I find particularly offensive. Indyra has explained exactly the point. Despite that I am incensed and can't hold my tongue on it. I love noobies. I love them because they are full of energy and enthousiasm and questions, but I HATE noobies like this. You are the reason the term "noobie" has a bad connotation to it. I had a similar situation with someone called wolfs who hadnt a clue what they were talking about but felt the need to slander me anyway. Usually I try SO hard to remain as neutal as possible on all matters, to try to think of all the points, but I've lost it here. Had enough. MD is a fantastic place with amazing people who give up their time to make sure you have the most fulfilling time possible, and you spit at them. Then you are surprised they spit back? well dont be.

As for Sparrhawk, yea I kinda get what he is saying here. I'm pretty sure you guys get what he is saying too. If I get paid for laying bricks and someone else doesn't, it doesnt make the one who doesnt get paid a better brick layer - but you can see why someone might be more likely to give them a spare fiver than the other bloke.


Z

[Blacknights]

From dst

RE:RE:RE:Help request
Do I look like I care?


RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:Help request
Yes I CARE! I care so much that I will go and hide in the darkest corner of my house and I will cry until I will run out of tears! My life has no goal anymore cause you don't like me ((((



ps:there's an ignore list for PMs. Be glad! You're the first on my ignore list

no comment

[Kyphis the Bard]

[quote name='Blacknights' timestamp='1292628253' post='75651']
From dst

RE:RE:RE:Help request
Do I look like I care?


RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:Help request
Yes I CARE! I care so much that I will go and hide in the darkest corner of my house and I will cry until I will run out of tears! My life has no goal anymore cause you don't like me ((((



ps:there's an ignore list for PMs. Be glad! You're the first on my ignore list

no comment
[/quote]
I notice the complete lack of context in those quotes. It is useless to show an argument in such a one sided manner, and will only cause people to disagree with you more. If you want any chance of having anyone agree with you, you gotta supply the context as well (as in, what was the message she was replying to, and you can bet she will still have a copy if you try to misquote)

[dst]

Let's see...

[quote]
*From: Blacknights (ID:198423)
*sent 2 weeks and 5 days ago Read later
[quote]Original message:
No, you're mad cause I did not tell you where the guy with the heads was hiding. And you talk about sincerity? Ha!
Original message[/quote]
RE:RE:Help request
I just say what i feel from you..

I dont regret .. So i dont care ..

I dont like you anyway~
[quote]Your reply to this message:
Do I look like I care? [/quote][/quote]


[quote]*From: Blacknights (ID:198423)
*sent 6 days and 1 hour ago Read later
[quote]Original message:
Do I look like I care? [/quote]

Original message
RE:RE:RE:RE:Help request
I dont like you hehe ..

I'm sure ...you care ..[/quote]