Wishpoints, Items, and Alt Abuse

[Phantom Orchid]

Is it alt abuse - a punishable offense - to create an item using WP from an alt and then give that same item to main character?

I am asking because obviously because of active-day WPs there are now lots of item requests going to Crafters, some from alts requesting items which would be created specifically for their main.

I would prefer to know what rules, if any, this would violate - instead of opinions.

If it is not clear, then please open this up for discussion of opinions.




[sup][edit - Paste from Rules and Restrictions][/sup]
[quote][list]
[*]You can have multiple accounts, to try out story, to experince new ways of play etc ..., however if you are detected that you are using them just to help one of your main accounts , all of them including the main will get banned.
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[/quote]

Edited August 7, 2011 by Phantom Orchid

[Seigheart]

From what I remember, Item transfer between alts is okay.

And there was a precedent for this as well with MRAlyon. He had created a bunch with his alts and then gave them to his Main.

[xrieg]

Well... If WP is awarded for a quest etc it may be considered a grey area...
I also understood that some contest (i.e. Broken Pattern) cannot be entered by alts - as alts cannot solve it independently from main.
With WP for active days I believe it there is no grey zone - no real original work by player to get them (for any char). Still please confirm it - if items transfers between alts is allowed with no limitations (and I would also assume Broken Pattern multisolution would be allowed) then I would regret I didn't give more days to my alts and from now on 20% of my MD time I will spend logging in to dozens of alt accounts I created or plan to

[Kafuuka]

[quote name='Vicarious' timestamp='1312744708' post='89750']
From what I remember, Item transfer between alts is okay.

And there was a precedent for this as well with MRAlyon. He had created a bunch with his alts and then gave them to his Main.
[/quote]
There's an official statement:
http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/7531-alt-abuse/page__view__findpost__p__64958

[Burns]

[quote]Ann. 1324 - [2010-03-07 02:19:12 - Alpha 9]
Not so long ago i issued a warning regarding alt abuse for taking advantage of the 5 credit promotion. Some of you ignored you. First to go is Ledah. 59 alts baned, main account imprisoned for undefined time. He can get out on special occasions or if someone with unban power decides so. Escaping the prison by other ways will increse punishment severely. For gathering silver from alts, all his items (2) and 98 silver got confiscated. For doing the crime so soon after a public warning (or during) not to do so he also receives a secondary punishment: attack reduced from 900+ to 1, defence reduced from 300+ to 1, power reduced from 200+ to 1. Kicked from alliance with 25% loyalty penalty.[/quote]

[quote]Ann. 1605 - [2010-08-23 17:04:22 - Stage 10]
Please take note that it is not permitted to use avatars as a way of transfering credits. Starting from tomorrow, transfer of avatars between alts will be restricted.[/quote]

[quote]Ann. 1711 - [2010-12-24 23:25:09 - Stage 10]
So, you should know that gifts were released a bit earlier, without the NEW restrictions. Today they were applied and you should know that now there is a activity requirement in order to get the gifts. IT IS NOT A BUG. Check you activity rating (total number of active days over max of your accoun, in profile page). This was done unannounced, in order to prevent alts from "harvesting" xmas gifts.[/quote]

Beyond any doubt, the transfer of silver, avatars and other gifts between alts is not allowed.
That some folks weren't punished yet doesn't mean that they have done right, as you see even silver is too much to shove around, therefore unique items are even more so. Including Enchanted Stones, yes, big brother IS watching.
Mur never bothers for a few abusing something, but when it gets too far, there'll be severe punishments.
[Edit: As Kafuuka linked while i was searching announcements]

Edited August 7, 2011 by Burns

[Kyphis the Bard]

Just as a note on the silver, there was a discussion about that somewhere on the forums where Mur said that you Can transfer silver around on your alts and mains, so long as it wasn't gained for free (that was a big part of the issue with the free credits thing). He also stipulated coins gifted by other players didn't count as free, and that getting coins via useing the "free credits" was also earning them as you had to do all the voting work.

I can't recall the location of the post and would suggest someone link to it so that we can be completely certain of what it says, I believe it was in a topic by mcvitie asking whether she could sell creatures from her alts and move the silver to her main.

[Eon]

http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/7444-item-swapping/page__st__20

[Phantom Orchid]

[url="http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/7444-item-swapping/page__view__findpost__p__64913"]http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/7444-item-swapping/page__view__findpost__p__64913[/url]
[quote]

[i]"gathering coins and items from alts and moving them on a main (or backwards) wont be considered alt abuse. Gaining coins for free and using more accounts to do that , is abuse and will be punished accordingly. At this point there should not be possible to get coins for free, please correct me if i am wrong!"[/i][/quote]

So, in the above post Mur speaks of [i]gathering[/i] items, but what about using WPs from an alt to [i]create[/i] items to benefit main account?

Item transfer from alt-main seems acceptable by Mur, as it stands, despite being scorned by many, but the issue I'm trying to clarify is using WP from alt to benefit main - specifically through item creation.

WPs seem to be relatively 'free' because of active days reward, but I'm not sure if they apply to the 'free' gathering of coins point that he made.

[Muratus del Mur]

the issue is that any rule stated before wasn't considering the current situation where alts can basically farm wishpoints. I can not give a final decision on this matter as it is now, but i can issue a temporary rule just so you know what and what not to do.

[color=#ff0000]As time passes i will know better what impact the activedays wp have on the realm and If the situation demands it, i will change this rule to fit. If nothing uncommon happens it remains as it is.[/color]


[b]Item creating using alts is allowed, but the crafters (or anyone able to create items at the cost of wishpoints) will be requested to be extra careful with this and not to allow anything they consider repeated abuse to happen. In other words, using this with decency, one, two items from your alts because those items are suited for your main character is FINE. Breeding alts to create a repeated source of items through wishpoints received for active days is NOT OK. The decision belongs to those that have this ability, about what is abuse and what is not. It is also their responsability to avoid such abuse and ensure they respect the guidelines i provided about what items can be created and what not.[/b]

To bring a level of responsability so to say, I will publicly ask the crafters (or anyone with the ability now or in the future) to specifically ask is the item creation request is for an other account (meaning using alts) or not. They should also base their decision if to create the item or not upon this information. This information should be kept confidential but in case of any trial, if you provide false information, it will definitely mean you had the intent to abuse.

I think everything stated here should be clear, yet if it is not, please ask.


If noticing repeated item creation requests from what they believe to be alts of same person, the crafters should warn about this rule. I have no itention to trap people to make "crimes" they have no clue about, the purpose of rules are to keep md balanced...lets not forget that.




[b]Clarification on alts and item transfers[/b]
Also, to say this again: item transfers and COIN transfers from and to alts is OK. If you are confused why..i can try to explain shortly. At the base of having those things stay unregenerable sources. For coins people pay money or trade goods, they are not receiving them for free. The goods they trade or the money they spend are the same regardless if taken cumulatively or individually. The advantage that they could get gold without a shop reset is a benefit considered in the gold "value" already. Items, (except now with the wp situation) where achieved also for something, not for free, so there was never the issue of cummulating "free" stuff to benefit a main. The items are also role dependent, accounts are too, this matters also when considering the impact of allowing alts to hold items...maybe as backup holders. The "trade" value of the items depends on their rarity and importance in the realm but also on the traders skill to sell or buy them. None of these changes if items are stored on one or more accounts belonging to same person (alts).