Resource Balancing

[Chewett]

Since another recent topic on this has degraded once into into abuse hurled complaints, im going to open a new one, more generally, on something i would like to know.

 

All the lands have given me their resource data now (i think) and therefore i will be going through it with Mur and others to balance it for AUTUMN2050 which requires certain conditions.

 

If anyone wants to make nice, friendly comments about what resources should be rarer/more common/more easily available i would like some feedback, so it is welcome.

 

If anyone wishs to start trolling, being offensive or whatever, then im going to lock the topic and do what mur does, change stuff without consulting people publicly. I like to talk to you publicly to find out general opinon rather than just doing it, but wont deal with all the rubbish that the forum is now full of. Your choice.

[Laphers]

My suggestion:

 

Rename Memorystones to Stones, increase the amounts and  create random stone resources upon harvesting like the herbs (coal, granite, shale, sandstone, flint, memorystone, etc.). This could allow future expandability without adding a new resource later.

 

I have not collected stones so this suggestion should be taken with  a grain of salt and input should be sought from those who do gather them.

[Chewett]

Also if people can vote using reputation on the ideas, that would be good :)

 

Thank you laphers for your comment, more stone type items would be good, but i dont think that memory stones will be changed in that regards, but it is something i shall consider and put forward in the coming discussions.

[dst]

How about you get a different byproduct when you collect from certain areas.

For example: you collect memory stones from GG, you get something (mountain related). You collect from Necro you got something else (something that you'd get by collecting in a plain's mine).

[Chewett]

Again, another useful comment. That sounds good, in combination with the above idea. In collecting memories from a land it makes sense that there be different byproducts, as you "clense" it away to produce a pure memory stone.

[nadrolski]

introduce a weight (for example.. weight: 1) to every resource that will be collected, and to those existing in everybody's inventory. not just on resources but also with other items.

 

the weight on each resources should somehow affect one's movement.

 

this weight could be applied to the viscosity feature.

 

the more you carry, the heavier the weight is, and the "slower" you should be able to move.

 

- - - 

 

if a scene visibly illustrates existing resource, it should have that resource available for collecting.

 

for example, water, adding more sources to make it common: a river is visible in Wind's Crossing, the same lake as with Willow's Walk and Angien's Ferry is visible in Sage's Path and Sage's Keep.

Edited August 9, 2013 by nadrolski

[Syrian]

i know its not so much about balance, in the sense that you wanted, but, whats the reason for the resources being the way they are? with max regen at 2/3, is it possible that it could be changed to the value of ideal regen and provide max regen from 0 resources? 

 

ie. a place with 20 resources is harvested to 14 for max regen with a total of 6 gathered, change the location to 6 resources available but provide max regen per day, 

 

/Sy

[rikstar]

I absolutely love that idea syrian. It would also prevent most of the hate around resource depletion.

Edited August 9, 2013 by rikstar

[rikstar]

I know this is not the best idea tp solve it, but if we dont change anything about this it will ruin md at some point. Because of all that hate about resources and depletion of it.

[Syrian]

lets not bring the topic about depletion and hate, this isnt what the topic is about, keep it to ideas only

 

/Sy

[DarkRaptor]

probably controversial but.. maybe a possible way to assure a long term self balancing system.

http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/13758-add-damage-by-usage-to-every-tool/

 

ps: i know.. probably too much work to do without garanteed results.. well maybe at least discuss it

[Chewett]

i know its not so much about balance, in the sense that you wanted, but, whats the reason for the resources being the way they are? with max regen at 2/3, is it possible that it could be changed to the value of ideal regen and provide max regen from 0 resources? 

 

ie. a place with 20 resources is harvested to 14 for max regen with a total of 6 gathered, change the location to 6 resources available but provide max regen per day, 

 

/Sy

 

The system is set up, as such, so that people can deplete and then harm the regeneration rate if they want. That isnt going to change because thats one of the "community" aspects. While it would remove much/all controversy around the gathering below the "good" maximum its not how it was meant/suggested to be.

 

probably controversial but.. maybe a possible way to assure a long term self balancing system.

http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/13758-add-damage-by-usage-to-every-tool/

 

ps: i know.. probably too much work to do without garanteed results.. well maybe at least discuss it

Actually i liked that idea, it opens a number of avenues to more social interaction, roles and similar.

[Maebius]

Hmm, I don't think Syrian's idea is best, for the reasons Chewett states.  There should be a "way for people to deplete"  even if I'm personally irritated when it happens.  Keep as many Doors open as possible, imho.

 

As for my Suggestion,  I really like dst's idea of tier2 resources being based on the scene, a bit more.  Rocks (per Lapher's suggestion?) in GG,  Clay in MB (water, etc!)? Sand in Necrovion?  Loam/Dirt in Loreroot?   So many ideas there, I cant' decide on one specifically. 

 

To answer the original psot,  I think curerntly Resources -seem-  to be fairly balanced, presuming that things like Lumber or Unidentified Herbs becume 'useful' or Cauldron items are made a bit more public to utilize them.   Currently, my worry is that the recent Water-Wars are paritally due to the fact Water is used in a number of different, very useful recipes and Bushie-harvest.   AUTUMN2050 hopefully will resolve that bit of current imbalance, so I'm not worried about current Resources until I see how that change works out.

 

(aside:  any thoughts on a Public Clickie-Cauldron, rather than tools to pass around?  Make one scene a proper "Laboratory"  of sorts!)

[rikstar]

What in my opinion is important to scatter some resources more across several lands. Like the bones they are only availeble to get in NC. And it would be great if some kind of team walms along some scenes to add extra resources to them. As the pump in the tribunal, you would expect that there will be water, but there is none. One could say its a dry pump, but its more fun when it has some logical function. There must be also other examples, but I do not know them.
Also salt water would be a neat addition, it could be placed at the beach in GG. And ome could extract salt from it via a cauldron.

[Chewett]

What in my opinion is important to scatter some resources more across several lands. Like the bones they are only availeble to get in NC. And it would be great if some kind of team walms along some scenes to add extra resources to them. As the pump in the tribunal, you would expect that there will be water, but there is none. One could say its a dry pump, but its more fun when it has some logical function. There must be also other examples, but I do not know them.
Also salt water would be a neat addition, it could be placed at the beach in GG. And ome could extract salt from it via a cauldron.

AUTUMN2050

[Chewett]

As a first and last warning, if you slander an idea on these type of topics, anywhere in the forum, aka not nicely. Then im going to close it, just because you quote it and make offensive comments in other places, im still going to close these threads.

Ideas should be nourished and encouraged.

[Sunfire]

My suggestion:

 

Rename Memorystones to Stones, increase the amounts and  create random stone resources upon harvesting like the herbs (coal, granite, shale, sandstone, flint, memorystone, etc.). This could allow future expandability without adding a new resource later.

I have not collected stones so this suggestion should be taken with  a grain of salt and input should be sought from those who do gather them

 

 

i agree stones would be a valuable addition, however i wouldnt just mingle them with memory stones

this leaves room for a mining group or guild

preferable based in the underground (rocky environment) as GG allready has a guild (fusioneers) and 2 private tools (fenths & memory stones)

 

and i find the different byproducts an interesting idea, yet i wouldnt base it on the land but more on the soil

scenes have sky visibility, maybe soil can be added as well

[No one]

Is this topic used to mislead us ?

 

Why don't you continue your previous topic ?

Or you can continue this one but still respond to the following question :

 

 

As this is really far way from topic, i have a question from you: what would happen if you'd have 1000 of same & each resource in a single place ?

What's the worst that can happen ?

 

As for :

As i have said before we are looking into trying to balance the resources. I have contacted a couple people to help me do some investigation but it appears people dont want to help, i shall have to make another forum post when i have time.

Resources need more balance, and they will, we just need to get some stats and do some legwork first.

 

Why don't you update "List of resources (from  Awiiya's K doc).xls".

 

Also, you can read this as a feedback .

 

 

And there are other topic on this same ... topic.

Also, I want to know the resource modifications before they are applied , with or without coder's veto.

Edited August 10, 2013 by No one

[Chewett]

I do not know what you mean by "mislead us"

 

1000 of every resource? It would entirely remove the social aspects of depletion, the point of regeneration, and make the game a lot flatter.

 

I see nothing to update on that list, unless i am missing your point.

 

I would encourage you to get actual discussion on your recommendations on the linked post, from lots of people from within your land before i spend more time looking over it, some of the suggestions seem very personal. e.g. Renaming the pub? why?

 

Wanting to know the changes before hand? Maybe. Or we might just implement it as we see fit. Its MD, so both has happened before, i cant possibly promise it to be one way or the other.

[No one]

Misleading because you open multiple topics on same subject and then disregard them without any other update.

 

Also, there are a few other topics on this very same subject, but you disregard them too.

 

So, what else are you looking for ?

You keep saying that you have a group for research on stuff. Put them to read the forum and gather & group the ideas.

You also have a topic with links for ideas to make it easier for them.

You have almost all MD , if you want, to do the research for YOU to disregard.

 

_____________________________________

Why don't you try the 1000 resource thing ? Make it regenerate to max every day. Make it an event for one or two weeks. See what happens.

I will give you some predictions:

 - lands with monopoles will try to prevent others from attaining the tools

 - same ppl will try to gather the most as they can get the fastest

 - so, who will win ?

 

You Chewett should quit your positions for a while / do nothing for a while but using your brain.

[Chewett]

I forget topics, i make a lot, you can help me being my secretary if you wish to aid me in that matter.

 

other points are personal, so have sent PM

Edited August 11, 2013 by Chewett

[Burns]

I think all shared tools should work in the same way. Currently, buckets and saws need mb/lr loyalty to be grabbed and used, necro and gg tools need loyalty to be grabbed, but can be used by anybody, and herb baskets and tea sets can be grabbed and used by anybody.
 
I think it would promote tool trade and cooperation if all tools were set to be grabbed with a value of land loyalty, and used by anybody. On the other hand, if all tools are set to be used with their land's loyalty, it would promote the trade of resources. Both concepts have their pros and cons, i guess it's a matter of taste which one you like more.
 
I'm against the scattered system, though, where some lands have a monopoly for the use of some tools, and others not. I think that it'd be a sensible system to trade a bucket for a saw for a week, for example, and both parties can see how well they can use their time. Currently, the bucket guys are running around to get water week after week, and the saw guys run for wood week after week, and everybody gets bored on their routines.

Edited August 11, 2013 by Burns

[dst]

In this case (if all lands get items that can be used by anyone BUT require land loyalty to grab them) , I want some shared items for UG as well. If Tribunal has them, I want some for my land.

[Dragual]

In this case (if all lands get items that can be used by anyone BUT require land loyalty to grab them) , I want some shared items for UG as well. If Tribunal has them, I want some for my land.

 

What items would you have? Perhaps a dirt shovel for fishing bait? 

[Maebius]

 

What items would you have? Perhaps a dirt shovel for fishing bait? 

 

 

Entomologist Tools (Magnifying Glass, tweezers, pins,  mothballs) for hunting/collecting  Bugs of course!   :)