Center of the Labyrinth

[DARK DEMON]

The exact answer to this is... 6_0x-0.5_1.

 

Many of the participants actually got this from the midpoint formula (or were close), but didn't give importance to it and never submitted it! :))

 

In truth, this is a major concept about the Labyrinth: its center coordinates are broken, i.e the only one which is not a whole number. It could only exist if you imagined and believed it to exist.

 

However, if you consider the Labyrinth as a rectangular mirror, and the center as the initial point where the "glass" breaks, the proof of its effect is visible and does exist physically (yes, you can see it if you come to the Labyrinth with this intention, and not the intention of "not getting lost" :P). You will get lost. You must be willing to get lost. If you draw a map, its even more so obvious, provided that you look at it from the correct perspective.

 

The Labyrinth will never give you what you expect from it. And what is unique about it is that those who actually realize this will not be surprised. Even then, expecting the unexpected is not enough. To truly understand it, you must enjoy doing so, and then it becomes a really simple matter. But managing to do this is not simple at all.

 

I'll be making more topics in the future, regarding the Labyrinth's association with the mind and the Void. Those may fill up more gaps as to how understand its secrets and concepts.

Edited December 19, 2014 by DARK DEMON

[Muratus del Mur]

thanks, i would want these also as research docs to place in the labyrinth,

don't worry they are also public and also in the research section..people will forget about these posts, but in-game they will remain forever

[Ungod]

clues of what level are you thinking of?

[Ary Endleg]

I don't get it.

[DARK DEMON]

I don't get it.

It was mostly for the participants. However, do find me in game and I'll always be willing to discuss anything about the Labyrinth.

[Shadowseeker]

Why do you base it on -0.5 in the coordinates? If you go strictly by geographical distance, it would be 0x0. A point which doesn't exist isn't something new, but why are the coordinates broken that specific way?

[Myth]

The labyrinth is spread over a 10 by 9 grid. 10 rows, 9 columns. Column wise, the middle point would be 0 (Y axis); row wise, it's between -1 and 0 (X axis) since this one ranges from -5 to 4.

 

Not being a integer number, the center is broken because it's a coordinate which can't physically exist, since every coordinate is made of integer numbers on the X and Y axis(es?) - except for the East. :p

Edited December 20, 2014 by Myth

[DARK DEMON]

Why do you base it on -0.5 in the coordinates? If you go strictly by geographical distance, it would be 0x0. A point which doesn't exist isn't something new, but why are the coordinates broken that specific way?

 

As Myth said, going strictly by geographical distance does not lead you to 0x0. It does not lead you anywhere, in fact.

 

0x0 does exist indeed (the scene was created long ago). It is inaccessible in any way, but it does exist. Its an illusion, in fact, fooling people to believe it is the center.

 

0x-0.5, however, doesn't exist at all... yet... maybe... how could it? :D

Edited December 20, 2014 by DARK DEMON

[AmberRune]

I'm thinking both are "right". Middle row is 4 from each end. Math says -0.5.

 

It seems more about if we hit the number he wanted since it was his quest and being not a whole number makes it all the less fitting with how things normally are which fit more with his intro.

 

I stuck to 0x0 in my entry but that's just me

[Shadowseeker]

Guess I miscounted the rows, that explains the midpoint...still, wouldn't it be more precise to say the point has shifted instead of claiming it is a point that can't exist? I mean there is a reason why a coordinate should exist which is 0x0, even if in reality the middle is supposed to be 0x-0.5

 

I think it should be kind of similiar to the GoE.

[Myth]

Oddly enough, the 4(+1) lands are also spread across the same 10 by 9 layout, the only difference being that there are 9 rows and 10 columns instead of the other way around. That's the first contradiction I found when I began mapping the place. Seemed to me that the center was forced.

[DARK DEMON]

Guess I miscounted the rows, that explains the midpoint...still, wouldn't it be more precise to say the point has shifted instead of claiming it is a point that can't exist? I mean there is a reason why a coordinate should exist which is 0x0, even if in reality the middle is supposed to be 0x-0.5

 

I think it should be kind of similiar to the GoE.

 

One of the hidden purposes of the quest was to give 0x-0.5 a reason to exist. Who ever claimed that it cannot exist? :)

 

Why did the point shift? What would your logic behind that be? If coordinates can "shift", wouldn't that apply to the whole of MD?

 

It cannot shift. Like I said, "your" center 0x0 indeed exists. If it shifted, then it would mean that it would have to disappear from one place in order to appear in the other. Still however, I am really curious about your logic :)

 

Why care about precision? Many of the participants actually suggested that there are multiple centers, or that there is no center. The Labyrinth is flexible. It is not mechanical. It almost never works or presents itself in the same way for any two people. Thus I believe precision is one of the least important aspects here, personally.

 

 

So what is it that makes just this one scene special? ;)

Edited December 20, 2014 by DARK DEMON

[Rophs]

0x0 is as close to the middle as 0x-1

 

A piece was removed and all the pieces shifted a little bit to take its place. The center didn't move, everything else moved realive to it (including the reference points with actual coordinates.)

[Shadowseeker]

As I said, I think it's similiar to the GoE. The middle, 0x0, but with the additions to MD and so on the actual middle isn't there anymore I think- thus creating a midpoint that has been shifted. I haven't precisely counted the rows and columns yet, but if Myths numbers are right, then that's even more reason to assume it is like that.

 

Per se you could define two midpoints: One point of origin, and one point of the middle of the results of changes (for whatever reasons).

 

As for the labyrinth and the actual reason why it has been shifted or is in this state, that's a whole another question. But I tend more towards shifted instead of saying it cannot exist unless we believe in it- because the fact that we can assume that it should be there but isn't there is similiar to the observers spot or even just a spot "lost in time". Claiming it cannot exist without belief would then be too imprecise.

 

edit: unprecise wording on cannot exist, changed to cannot exist without belief

Edited December 20, 2014 by Shadowseeker

[AmberRune]

One of the hidden purposes of the quest was to give 0x-0.5 a reason to exist. Who ever claimed that it cannot exist? :)

Basically the grid system of the majority of the lands excluding the east because it's not on a grid.

 

 

Why care about precision? Many of the participants actually suggested that there are multiple centers, or that there is no center. The Labyrinth is flexible. It is not mechanical. It almost never works or presents itself in the same way for any two people. Thus I believe precision is one of the least important aspects here, personally.

 

Because you asked the participants to find a number and explain it with "about there" not being close enough. Also, you number had a DECIMAL which seems to suggest some amount of precision in measuring and that it did matter to you.

[DARK DEMON]

As I said, I think it's similiar to the GoE. The middle, 0x0, but with the additions to MD and so on the actual middle isn't there anymore I think- thus creating a midpoint that has been shifted.

 

This is beautifully awesome. I always knew (and told people) that the Labyrinth is in a way connected to the whole of MD, but that was in a different sense. What you just said is actually very good evidence to make one invest brain+time pondering about this point of view...

 

Thank you for bringing this up.

 

Claiming it cannot exist without belief would then be too imprecise.

 

Don't we all agree that there are 10 lands in MD? Necrovion, Loreroot, Golemus, Marind Bell, Underground, East, Prison, Labyrinth, MDA and NML? This is automatic acknowledgement that these 10 lands exist and no more.

 

Now, what if I just say that a dozen more lands existed? Oh, I know you don't believe they do, but they do exist. How does it sound this way? :)

 

 

We can never say that something exists, without believing so.

Because you asked the participants to find a number and explain it with "about there" not being close enough. Also, you number had a DECIMAL which seems to suggest some amount of precision in measuring and that it did matter to you.

 

Shadowseeker's and my own context of the word "precision" is different from mathematical precision. There IS evidence to support 0x-0.5 as the center, and whoever finds this evidence will know precisely what its connection is.

Edited December 20, 2014 by DARK DEMON

[AmberRune]

And there is also evidence for a 0x0 center. It may be drier or more plain than other answers but there is evidence for it

[dst]

And there is also evidence for a 0x0 center. It may be drier or more plain than other answers but there is evidence for it

 

0x0 does exist indeed (the scene was created long ago). It is inaccessible in any way, but it does exist. Its an illusion, in fact, fooling people to believe it is the center.

 

[DARK DEMON]

And there is also evidence for a 0x0 center. It may be drier or more plain than other answers but there is evidence for it

 

Nobody denies that. Those who have said that there are multiple centers, are free to believe so. Those who say there are none, are also free to believe so.

 

But this quest encouraged people to find evidence and realize a new center, one which nobody else had thought of before.

 

 

And, what dst posted, indeed :P

 

If a thing such as the center of the Labyrinth was meant to be a simple thing to believe, then what was the reason for 0x0 being inaccessible? People also thought that 0x0 didn't exist, because there was no way to access it. But the fact that it does, changes everything.

 

Its a never-ending topic with never-ending thoughts. Couple that with the fact that any two people will not entirely agree with the other's interpretation, and you have an insanely interesting concept worthy of research. :P

Edited December 20, 2014 by DARK DEMON

[Azrafar]

Yes, there can be multiple centers, depending on the point of view. I admit I didn't think of 0x-0.5 (for me it was obvious that it exists and I searcehed for the non existant one :P). I tought it was 0x0, also I tought of a central mirror axis and one mirror axis even outside the labyrinth. Because as I interpreted it, center doesn't neceserily mean one point. It can be a line too.

[Ary Endleg]

I still don't get it. What's the point of center, or more specifically, what's the point of finding the center? How does it affect anything? What does it enable? Center has been found, GREAT, now what?

[DARK DEMON]

I still don't get it. What's the point of center, or more specifically, what's the point of finding the center? How does it affect anything? What does it enable? Center has been found, GREAT, now what?

 

You will see the answer for yourself in a few days, I guarantee you :)

[Myth]

I still don't get it. What's the point of center, or more specifically, what's the point of finding the center? How does it affect anything? What does it enable? Center has been found, GREAT, now what?

 

The center is everything. Identity lies at the core of everything. :P

 

The center in each of us is what we build ourselves around.

 

One could argue that what I just said has no practical value or implications, but I'm not that sure, when it comes to the mind.

Edited December 20, 2014 by Myth

[dst]

 

And, what dst posted, indeed :P

 

 

I pointed out the inconsistency in your claims and the fact that Amber is more right (I know that one right can be more right than other)  than Ashtir if we are to judge by what already exists (I am not taken into consideration the fact that you have might created 0.x scenes just to sustain your quest).

 

So make up your mind because so far what you've done is to contradict yourself.

[DARK DEMON]

 

I pointed out the inconsistency in your claims and the fact that Amber is more right (I know that one right can be more right than other)  than Ashtir if we are to judge by what already exists (I am not taken into consideration the fact that you have might created 0.x scenes just to sustain your quest).

 

So make up your mind because so far what you've done is to contradict yourself.

 

Actually, if you put it that way, one wouldn't ever have an exact way to prove 0x0 at all.

 

I, just now, stated that it existed. Before this, I highly doubt that you could say 0x0 is right, judging by what "existed".

 

 

Amber hasn't even stated any evidence for 0x0 for you to make a comment on which is "more right".

 

Once your mind is involved in this kind of thing, its very difficult to "make it up". You'll spend the rest of your life trying to figure out which is more "right". I'd rather accept both as "right" and not delve on the "more" aspect.

Edited December 20, 2014 by DARK DEMON