Necrovion and it's alliances

[Azull]

When I joined Necrovion there were two alliances in this land. The Necrovian Sentinels and The Tainted Warriors. The Sentinels were disbanded by a player during Jester's reign for much the same reasons TW are disbanded now.

I never asked for the Sentinels to be returned. This alliance was the result of a covenant between humans and shades. It's destruction and subsequent lack of reactions from the shades was a symbol this covenant no longer exists. The only thing that remains is that humans are allowed to live in Necrovion. I feel the Sentinels should remain dead until such time a new covenant is made. (which seems unlikely to happen anytime soon)

Of course there is a practical reason too. An alliance with that many seats is impossible to protect. And since alliance taking has become such a popular and in many cases easy to do hobby, why bother.

 

In August 2011 after Jester left Necrovion and joined SoS in the east, Tainted Warriors were 

disbanded by a player who acted as Mur's cats-paw. A few days later the land was closed and we were left with nothing. But it didn't mean the end of Necrovian society. Quite the contrary in fact.

Some time later the alliance was given back to us because of a wish rewarded in an unexpected way (ann. 2034). Over the past years it was taken from us twice more because of misplaced trust and treason. Twice we got it back by use of illusions. With Peace gone this is not an option now. But is that such a bad thing? We don't think so. 

 

The Necrovian social and political structure we built is not defined by its alliance. In reality an alliance is a tool with a few useful features and a badge (of pride). Nothing more. I challenge anyone to prove me otherwise.

Four years ago we made the foundation for this Necrovion without an alliance. Having none now doesn't affect us beyond the loss of a few gadgets. Necrovian society, or whatever colorful name one might prefer for us, still exists. Having no alliance doesn't change that.  

Edited March 7, 2016 by Azull

[Blackwoodforest]

I agree, there is no alliance needed to "feel" like a true Necrovian citizen or you name it. But its kind of needed for ingame balance of game related features like wars, leadership discussions, further games , etc. In this aspect, we should ask if a disbanned alliance need to stay that way. Why can´t NC not simply build another one? you know, elections, politics etc?

[Eon]

Twice we got it back by use of illusions. With Peace gone this is not an option now. But is that such a bad thing? We don't think so. 

 

 

No, only once was it taken back by illusions. The very first time it was taken TTL ended up giving it back. The second time Peace was about to quit the game entirely and then someone pointed out to her that she was in an illusion and could get the alliance back by leaving it, so she did that.

[Azull]

The very first time it was taken TTL ended up giving it back.

 

I think you forgot the time Leixer helped you take it? You took it twice as I recall. Once with help of Leixer and once via Jester.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Azull

[Eon]

I think you forgot the time Leixer helped you take it?

Once again you are mistaken. For at least a month TTL and I were planning on taking it over. TTL thought you were a complete joke of a leader and wanted to run things himself. A week before we were going to follow through on our plan he decided to stop logging on, so a week later I went through with the plan myself by getting Leixer to invite me. I left TTL in because I figured he'd come back soon and I did give him my word I'd leave him in. He was into Peace and planned on visiting her soon, so to make her happy when she contacted him about it he gave it back. He hasn't played much since after.

 

The second time it was taken over I convinced Jester to help me.

 

Two times, one illusion.

[Azull]

I didn't know that. Or maybe I forgot. 

In any case, thank you for correcting that. 

[dst]

 

Of course there is a practical reason too. An alliance with that many seats is impossible to protect. And since alliance taking has become such a popular and in many cases easy to do hobby, why bother.

 

The Necrovian social and political structure we built is not defined by its alliance. In reality an alliance is a tool with a few useful features and a badge (of pride). Nothing more. I challenge anyone to prove me otherwise.

 

 

 

 

From here:

http://magicduel.invisionzone.com/topic/17174-fate-of-necrovion/page-2

 

 

I received offers to "buy back" the ally via wishpoints and trust points, answer is no, not this time

 

I guess you just proved yourself wrong.

[Aethon]

From a "RP" perspective, rather than purely mechanical, the Shade Sentinel granted Khalazhad leadership over all humans in Necrovion, no? He must have done this for more reason than simply wanting to make an alliance? So in that respect, alliances mean nothing, granted.

 

However; losing both alliances, so many times, having the land closed and having so many "interventions" must show a kind of "weakness" and vulnerability? -- You threatened the protection of Necrovion by allowing an outsider to gain free reign, even if it was only over a small part of the land.

 

If I were the shade sentinel; I would seriously be wondering if the decision I made, so long ago...is still suitable for the current monarchs and citizens. I wouldn't take too kindly to the "humans" messing around with my Land and disrupting the balance I so fought to keep.

 

Perhaps it's time for the sentinel to speak.

[Neno Veliki]

And thats how a great plan failed miserably. I dont say that dst didnt do any damage but saying that she has conquered Necrovion is a bit pretentious and delusional. She claimed lands alliance and then she destroyed it, leaving herself with empty hands. Thats where it took the ill turn to her. I guess her desire to destroy us was too big so it blurred her mind and led her to a mistake. With doing that she didnt do much damage to our structure within Necrovion, didnt took control of the land, people, kings items or lands relics. She didnt make any of us kneel before her and recognise her as a land leader and with nothing to offer she doesnt really have the right for anything to ask (i know dst didnt ask for anything but someone from her pack did it for her). As it may have started as a great conquest it then failed and ended up as a plain act of terrorism. Necrovion was attacked more than once and as some may see it as a weakness i see it as being thorn in the eye of many. Some may also see it like dst destroyed us, but i would say, not even dst managed to destroy us. In the end were still here, standing, not kneeling. I admire the dedication she had about it but nothing else.

[dst]

Neno, neno, neno....so bitter...

Can't wait to be able to make certain info public.

 

Also there is no "pack". We're not like you, a brainless mind. We're highly intelligent individuals. And funny.

[Assira the Black]

 

When I joined Necrovion there were two alliances in this land. The Necrovian Sentinels and The Tainted Warriors. The Sentinels were disbanded by a player during Jester's reign for much the same reasons TW are disbanded now.

I never asked for the Sentinels to be returned. This alliance was the result of a covenant between humans and shades. It's destruction and subsequent lack of reactions from the shades was a symbol this covenant no longer exists. The only thing that remains is that humans are allowed to live in Necrovion. I feel the Sentinels should remain dead until such time a new covenant is made. (which seems unlikely to happen anytime soon)

Of course there is a practical reason too. An alliance with that many seats is impossible to protect. And since alliance taking has become such a popular and in many cases easy to do hobby, why bother.

 

In August 2011 after Jester left Necrovion and joined SoS in the east, Tainted Warriors were 

disbanded by a player who acted as Mur's cats-paw. A few days later the land was closed and we were left with nothing. But it didn't mean the end of Necrovian society. Quite the contrary in fact.

Some time later the alliance was given back to us because of a wish rewarded in an unexpected way (ann. 2034). Over the past years it was taken from us twice more because of misplaced trust and treason. Twice we got it back by use of illusions. With Peace gone this is not an option now. But is that such a bad thing? We don't think so. 

 

The Necrovian social and political structure we built is not defined by its alliance. In reality an alliance is a tool with a few useful features and a badge (of pride). Nothing more. I challenge anyone to prove me otherwise.

Four years ago we made the foundation for this Necrovion without an alliance. Having none now doesn't affect us beyond the loss of a few gadgets. Necrovian society, or whatever colorful name one might prefer for us, still exists. Having no alliance doesn't change that.  

 

I agree that a land's society can continue to move forward with out an alliance. But that is because the current views of what an alliance is has changed from what it once was. For better or worst. An alliance is suppose to be a symbol and a focus of the ideals of a group. Though this can be represented with out the physical badge... with the changing of times people have started to or have been seeing the alliance badges as meaningless (this is used generally and from what I have noticed of others).

 

Alliances have started to lose their meaning in several ways: inactivity, lack of direction, public connection, and/or takeovers/lack of response to takeovers.

 

That is a general overview not all alliances have all of that list, some have a few, a mixture, or none at all. I leave that up to people's opinions. Inactivity because of rl is something we all deal with but that is not what I am speaking about when applied to alliances. What I mean is that some alliances do not have much of a presence in MD even at peak times of activity. Lack of direction, is that some join alliances but then it is just a badge, there is no goal or forward movement. It is just there. Public connection, in that alliances do not interact with each other as alliance members publicly... there may be behind the scenes interaction, but people do not see the interactions or can participate in the interactions. As for the takeovers there is a few points to that... In my opinion, takeovers are currently damaging to md at this point in time because people are 'tired' of it happening and no longer have the will to fight back. It is part of this response to take overs that leads to the lack of caring if the alliance is taken over. But because of all the takeovers the land's social structure still exists, because it had too. I am not saying anyone is in the wrong I am pointing out weak points to lack of caring and the takeovers, do with it as you will (general you, as in all that apply to this situation).

 

I have found that overall I do not like being in an alliance, the alliances of today are too stagnant or limiting for me. I prefer moving forward, to do something, and not have to ask permission to run with an idea... a storyline, or to create a form of chaos myself.     

[Aeoshattr]

Here's my take on things, because hopefully I calmed down enough to be able to talk about this. This is one of my infamous text walls (and quite a heartfelt one too), you have been warned, but I will try and summarise it in a TL;DR at the end. 

 

1. Necrovion.

I agree with Azull, to a great extent. This is both because I felt more integrated in Necrovion than in any other land I have been before. I like to believe that it transcended just the nature of an alliance, as I have been a citizen of Necrovion for more than a year before joining the Tainted Warriors; I'll be honest, I was very, very happy as a citizen. To me, the badge was more of a symbol of recognition when it was received; I didn't see it as a necessity, but it being given to me actually made me happy (which to those who know me, know is a big deal. I'm really never happy). I don't believe that Necrovion, as it stands today, is defined by any alliance it has or has had.

 

2. Reactions and comments.

Yes, people are bitter and defensive. Thorny and hardened. I think it's just a reality of MD... So unfortunately, accusations and acidic words do start flying, but it's only natural that they do so, taking into account how people are. Is it okay? No. Is it a reality? Yeah. My opinion? Can't make an omelet without breaking the eggs, take it or leave it. I actually had to try really hard to not say anything, other than the outburst I had in the in-game chat in the first few minutes after it happened.

 

3. View on alliances.

I think Assira pointed at a few things very accurately, so I'll reiterate those with my own perspective. 

I think alliances might have lost some of the "wow factor" they used to have. I think this is more probably 50% because most of those in MD are veterans. Alliances don't phase us that much anymore. We know what they're about. So to us, it looks like they devalued, like they lost their meaning. However, they also did lose part of their meaning (it's not just in our heads). If you look at alliances from a distance, maybe 1 or 2 stand out as unique. The rest are really the same thing, but with different artwork and in different lands (keep in mind, I might be a bit extreme here, but my point remains: compare GG to GotR, to SoE or KoB and then compare DoB with GotR or any of the previously mentioned, and you should see what I mean). But this is because people are not as involved as they used to be, IMO, rather than because of an intrinsic flaw in the alliances. Also, no offence meant to any ally mentioned.

The rest of the harm, IMO, is done by repeated takeovers. I really want to believe that they are done in an attempt to make MD progress, rather than as some sort of selfish, coercive method to obtain personal gain. Please let me have that delusion, if I'm wrong. But I think the huge, huge thing that this method misses is the fact that alliances are, in fact, made of people. Hit them once, they might fight back. Hit them twice, maybe. But when everybody is getting hit again and again all around you, you start to think more about how to keep what you have rather than what to actually do with it - I think this would be a main point. It becomes a dead long-term 'savings' account rather than an investment. Look at the reaction the vast population had to the economic crisis in the 2000s. It was all about 'saving what you have' rather than 'correcting and making plans to improve in the future'. The way I see it, things will just get progressively worse, and I think that in the most recent 2 (excluding TW) takeovers, you can see that active people, alliance leaders that actually had a plan and vision left (or are significantly less active/visible now). 

Finally? Very superficial, perhaps, but the fewer alliances there are, the more barren the game looks. Yes, I really like the badges, their art. I think they had a big, big "wow factor" to them, especially for new players. But now, I think a massive number of alliances are dead, with all the "wow" they brought gone. Some badges had a lot of symbolism to them, a lot about the alliance or its land could be learned just by looking at the badge. And now that's  gone. Sure, you might still see it in some capitols, but it's no longer in the game. It's no longer flowing, it's no longer present in the public eye. And it saddens me that most likely, that is permanent and will not improve in the future.

 

TL;DR

• NC is more than its alliances, through the people who inhabit and rule it.
• Can't throw a tomato at a fan and expect to not get a mess.
• All alliances have lost some of their 'oomph' because of lack of involvement, repeated takeovers, reduced population, and a natural tendency to focus on protecting rather than being out-going when threatened. I think a coordinated effort is necessary to change this, if my delusional view that "change and improvement of MD" is the ultimate goal is correct.

[Muratus del Mur]

Sometimes i wonder if nobody can see the SS in some of my actions or decisions. :ph34r:

[Assira the Black]

For some our characters are extensions of ourselves. I know that my successful characters are both similar and different from who I am. If they are too different then I lose interest and can not 'be' them. Too the same, then I get bored. There has to be just a balance for me. Most game I get bored very easily and move on to another game, but MD keeps bringing me back. That is because I like puzzles, the interaction, making quests/events, moving forward, exploring new concepts, but what really draws me in is the potential. The journey of making things better, improving, or moving towards a goal.

 

 

Earlier I pointed out weaknesses with views on alliances in general but that is not because I want to bring people down. Its because I see possibilities of where things could be, but it is not in my nature to stop there. I also see how these things can be achieved with what is available in the now, or if it can not be achieved at least lay the foundation or stepping stones to reach it. It might be optimistic of me and I may hit my head against the wall several times, but if something fails then I just try something else.

Edited March 12, 2016 by Assira the Black

[haustorium]

what about a restructure of NC populous. if the alliances mean nothing and the main players are as Aeoshattr said " think more about how to keep what you have rather than what to actually do with it - I think this would be a main point. It becomes a dead long-term 'savings' account rather than an investment. "

 

Then it makes sense that a restructure of NC would be appropriate. 

 

just my 2 cents