Lib Mp5

[Yrthilian]

Ok this is a for realy idea and looking to see what the public think

I was thinking of useing 5 of the MP5 libs to setup
regen rits at the GoS in MDA. The 5 libs will be on
as much as posiable.

This is more a what can the libs do for the public
This will be open to all players of MP5 to use in order
to help keep their xp cap down.

So please any comment are welcome

(Disclaimer: this is not a test this is a proper do the public agree to this or not)

Thanks
yrth

[Prince Marvolo]

No, if people want regen, they should learn to help eachother. Not depending on something that makes it more easy.

If you have problems with the XP cap - then Talk to others and set up some rits in group? It'll improve more to the gameplay than mindlessly attacking thise Libs.

[Tarquinus]

I hate to disagree with Marv, but I think this would be a good use of the Libs. I have trouble giving bursts away, which used to be my most reliable means of losing XP. I applaud those who have bothered to hang around GoS with Regen rituals set: thank you. I have a finite amount of time I can be online as Tarq and Keith, and you make my time a little bit easier, a little bit more pleasurable.

[Blackwoodforest]

I am the same opinion as Marvolo is. You should find ways and players for this and no bots somewhere.

[Prince Marvolo]

[quote name='Tarquinus' date='07 July 2010 - 12:05 PM' timestamp='1278497143' post='63571']
[i]I hate to disagree with Marv, but I think this would be a good use of the Libs. I have trouble giving bursts away, which used to be my most reliable means of losing XP. [/i][u]I applaud those who have bothered to hang around GoS with Regen rituals set: thank you. [/u][i]I have a finite amount of time I can be online as Tarq and Keith, and you make my time a little bit easier, a little bit more pleasurable.[/i]
[/quote]

Thats the solution I think... Having REAL people there instead of 'Bots'
I understand it makes things easier but.. What do you learn of it? You learn to depend on the Libs, instead of learning to know people who face the same problem and working on a solution Together

[Yrthilian]

Sorry i have to point out when one askes other for help
what is provided is more alt and not a [u]REAL[/u] player
so there really is no diffrence in the bot/player

This is only for MP5 so learning to depend on each other
has already happened and this would not be an option
if everyone could find a real player to help them.

The fact is many other use bots/alts to help lower their xp
so the libs in turn would be no diffrence really. Well in my view
that is.

I would feel this would make the proccess quicker and in the long run
help but if people are very agenst it i wont do it. But since there has
been very little responce i will take it as a go ahead. Unless i see a
bigger responce agenst the idea.

[apophys]

I personally approve of such a use of the Libs. However, seeing that the GoS is similar enough to the GGG, Mur may not approve of having alts idle there for people to farm on. So he might limit use to 1 Lib at a time. Ask him, or let us hope he reads this thread.


As I have been idle in the GGG at mp4 for public service, so I will be idle at the GoS with regen.

[Prince Marvolo]

[quote name='Yrthilian' date='07 July 2010 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1278513885' post='63583']
Sorry i have to point out when one askes other for help
what is provided is more alt and not a [u]REAL[/u] player
so there really is no diffrence in the bot/player
[/quote]

So because it is 'already done' it is ok?
Is it, because Everyone jumps into a river, you should do it also? And make it public as 'a good thing'

[quote name='Yrthilian' date='07 July 2010 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1278513885' post='63583']
This is only for MP5 so learning to depend on each other
has already happened and this would not be an option
if everyone could find a real player to help them.
[/quote]

"I learned how to communicate, so I guess I can stop doing it now" thats what you are saying
This would indeed not be an option if people were not that lazy...

[quote name='Yrthilian' date='07 July 2010 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1278513885' post='63583']
The fact is many other use bots/alts to help lower their xp
so the libs in turn would be no diffrence really. Well in my view
that is.
[/quote]

thats like giving a pyroman a flamethrower
"He's already doing it, so, it'll make no difference"

[quote name='Yrthilian' date='07 July 2010 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1278513885' post='63583']
I would feel this would make the proccess quicker and in the long run
help but if people are very agenst it i wont do it. But since there has
been very little responce i will take it as a go ahead. Unless i see a
bigger responce agenst the idea.
[/quote]

Is it supposed to be quick?
And maybe you need to wait a little bit - it has been barely 7 hours since you posted this.

--

As a reply to Apophys; Indeed - Another issue: Alt Abuse

[Totenkopf]

i think it's an excellent idea, especially as decreasing the max number of trees in a rit has definitely made losing xp harder.

[Mya Celestia]

[color="#8B0000"][font="Palatino Linotype"]I can understand the mixed review. It does seem like a mindless grind. People standing around silently hitting some idle character.

I've found very few willing to absorb xp for someone else though. They may set one or two rits, which is appreciated. However, if you cannot leave your alliance for whatever reason, one or two rits doesn't do much for you. Also, now that we cannot use a 6 tree rit to lower xp, it takes even longer.

Even if yrth set up the Libs, people would still be around to talk to. Personally, I see him setting up 4 or 5 Libs as a help to the community. It gets people in and out faster, and back into the battle frey.

If having them on frequently is an issue, he could set a schedule. He could put them up randomly, too. There are several positive ways this could be handled. Yrth has found a positive way to use the Libs. He's trying to help the community. That's a good thing isn't it? [/font][/color]

[CrazyMike]

Most of the regen sets at GoS are alts.

I am not saying that its right or wrong, but it is very helpful for us that need to lose xp fast.

Here is a scenario.... no alts for GoS. All main accs only. A whole bunch of active players slowly lowering their xp there. Normally those that need to lower their xp are active players. A whole group of active players sitting ard GoS hitting at other active players who has regen sets. Give it a month, and a whole new issue will turn up about MD being boring.

Before this, newbies hang out at GGG and complains come in.

Now active players are forced to stay in GoS longer than necessary..... more complains?

Adding Libs there has more pros than cons.

[Shemhazaj]

[font="Book Antiqua"][color="#696969"]I'd agree with Marv if not for one thing...
being in alliance makes regen work awfully slowly
I found 5 people that used regen with me today.
After half day of using it I lost 5 mil...
and I don't want to drop the badge every time I get close to being capped.
that makes gaining loyalty bit pointless.[/color][/font]

[No one]

[quote name='Shemhazaj' date='07 July 2010 - 07:45 PM' timestamp='1278521125' post='63592']
[font="Book Antiqua"][color="#696969"]I'd agree with Marv if not for one thing...being in alliance makes regen work awfully slowlyI found 5 people that used regen with me today.After half day of using it I lost 5 mil...and I don't want to drop the badge every time I get close to being capped.that makes gaining loyalty bit pointless.[/color][/font]
[/quote]

Shemhazaj, please read the topic.

[quote name='Prince Marvolo' date='07 July 2010 - 06:24 PM' timestamp='1278516283' post='63586']
This would indeed not be an option if people were not that lazy...
[/quote]

If ppl don't LIKE the advantages of an alliance, then they should quit. But wanting the advantages from alliance & non alliance ... then keep on dreaming.

[size="5"][b]Alliances are not mandatory, they are a privilege.[/b][/size]

Edited July 11, 2010 by dst

[Lifeline]

[quote name='No one' date='12 July 2010 - 12:41 AM' timestamp='1278888106' post='63813']
[size="5"][b]Alliances are not mandatory, they are a privilege.[/b][/size]
[/quote]

sorry but why are alliances a priviledge? in every single aspect regarding the battle mechanics alliances are nothing but a burden and make ur life harder.
- ur round count gets dropped which is almost always very bad.
- u cant train decently because all u can do is take but rarely give since people can only attack u all 25minutes.
- xp loosing becomes horrible if u dont have huge VE
- mp3 and mp4s get killed but much stronger mp5s
- the attack for loyality sucks. seeing ur honor reward there is much more useful. and much more important attacking alliance members gives u no honor reward (for those that get it)

and the good points? some lously stats u get from housing? which is mostly not even worth mentioning? getting a little less attacked than usually?

joining an alliance really screws u. its only good for mp6s otherwise it only handycaps u.

just being a normal citizen is 10times better than being in an alliance. one gets punished badly for being in an alliance which should be the other way around in my opinion. with the new regen timers alliances are at least not as bad as they used to be but still very bad so some more regen rit alts are a good idea in my opinion.

[dst]

Then let's just forget about alliances and play without.
And what do you expect? To have only advantages in an ally?

"- ur round count gets dropped which is almost always very bad. "
Why is bad? Except for the time when you want to lose xp this has little to no influence.
"- u cant train decently because all u can do is take but rarely give since people can only attack u all 25minutes."
Oh...what an altruist! This game is not about team playing. Nor about doing good deeds in terms of "what is mine is yours and so on". Besides...isn't this an RPG game? Aren't you supposed to RP more then you are supposed to fight?
"- xp loosing becomes horrible if u dont have huge VE"
This tells enough about your game mechanics that are related to something else besides farming libs for stats.
"- mp3 and mp4s get killed but much stronger mp5s"
So? Nobody forces anyone to join an ally. If you join an ally you KNOW what you're getting yourself into. If you don't then you're either ignorant or you just don't care.
"- the attack for loyality sucks. seeing ur honor reward there is much more useful. and much more important attacking alliance members gives u no honor reward (for those that get it)"
Pfff...I am balanced. The only people I can attack are alliance members BECAUSE they do not give me negative honor. THIS is how the game is supposed to be played. Not like you are doing it. Or at least not anymore. I've been where you are and I know how things are and I reached the conclusion that being balanced is waaay more better then having tons of loses. Btw: alliance members DO give you honor. The only difference is that honor is strictly related to the amount of loyalty you get (and something else but I spoiled enough things here so I will stop)


Conclusion: alliances are a privilege.

As for the Libs:you all know that I do a similar thing with 2 of my alts. I am doing it for 18 months. Nobody complained and everybody used them. What's the difference between using the Libs and using my 2 alts?

Edited July 12, 2010 by dst

[Shemhazaj]

[quote]Shemhazaj, please read the topic.[/quote]

[font="Book Antiqua"][color="#696969"]topic:
What do you think of the libs used for regen rits

Marvolo said:
"No, if people want regen, they should learn to help eachother."

my answer:
"I'd agree with Marv if not for one thing...
being in alliance makes regen work awfully slowly."

sorry, but what so "not on topic" is about that, No One?
I answered the question.(and gave my explanation on why)
You didn't.[/color][/font]

[Shadowseeker]

[quote name='No one' date='12 July 2010 - 12:41 AM' timestamp='1278888106' post='63813']
Shemhazaj, please [b]read[/b] the topic.
[/quote]

I repeat..that wasn't a post saying you're offtopic..but rather asking you to read up. Because you keep complaining about regen being slow while marv said "if people were not that lazy" a few posts ago.

As long as the libs are used for the general public..nevertheless it's still alt abuse. I'd say no on that, simply because people ought to be able to get regen without 40 alts or so.

[Shemhazaj]

[quote name='Shadowseeker' date='12 July 2010 - 12:44 PM' timestamp='1278935055' post='63830']
I repeat..that wasn't a post saying you're offtopic..but rather asking you to read up. Because you keep complaining about regen being slow while marv said "if people were not that lazy" a few posts ago.

As long as the libs are used for the general public..nevertheless it's still alt abuse. I'd say no on that, simply because people ought to be able to get regen without 40 alts or so.
[/quote]

[font="Book Antiqua"][color="#696969"]I did read it.
I do not KEEP complaining. I said that only once. And ok, Mya mentioned it earlier, so would you rather if I only said "yes" without explaining why?
And as for people being lazy. Also commented on that. Saying that I'm not lazy and found other that were not lazy and how long took me to lose not so much xp.[/color][/font]

[No one]

@Shemhazaj: read all the information that I gave you in my post, INCLUDING the time of the quotes. Not that "you were not on topic" , as Shadowseeker already told you, it was just that you don't read (read careful) what was stated before you.
As a personal suggestion, you should try to understand the difference between "be on / off topic" and "read the topic".


@Lifeline: thank you for pointing out what you think of alliances. Do consider that some consider the same points a being positive points. It is like a coin seen from both sides, only a point of view.

Also, about "showing honor values" ... I don't know if you are playing us for fools or you are just hypocrite.

And ... you NO LONGER like alliances just because you can get attacked.

As I see that there is no more respect for spoilers, here is mine:
For those that don't know why you hate alliances ... you have about 3500 more loses. Which makes you virtually unbeatable by normal players (as they lose up to 1k honor) but will also make you lose stats every time you lose a fight (not that you care ... and I will not say why if you don't insist on this).

So, cut the bs and act to your decisions.


PS: I am sorry for
- being rude, but both your answers are either rude or ill intended.
- pointing (naming ppl) but there was no other way to respond to you in this topic.
- for getting really offtopic to respond to you

Edited July 12, 2010 by No one

[MRHoly One]

it my not be worth much, but in my opinion if there is a sanctioned place to loose exp established and is up and running all the time, what is the point of having exp at all? might as well eliminate the exp gain altogether.

i vote NO.

[Lifeline]

lol i hate alliances now xD ...right because i stayed for 1 1/2 years straight in the same alliance without ever jumping out. and now that i am temporary out of one i am permanently in winds sanct without ever leaving it.
even if i was perfectly balanced (what is almost impossible for me to even try) none of my arguments would change. how can it be a different view?
mp3s and mp4s get attacked by much stronger people so how can that be beneficial for them? xp loosing consumes imensly more time ...so yes right thats a priveledge that helps u.
its completely awesome how one can state a few points regarding what he/she thinks of something and directly gets personally attacked for it with some weird examples how it applies on that person. especially those contradiction ones.... first u say i hate alliance because i get attacked and just 2 sentence later u say i dont care about being attacked anyway. its true i dont care about that skilldamage at all but just as u said it certainly has nothing to do with alliances.

anyway back on topic: fighting is already hard enough these days so especially some boring time consuming activities like xp loosing should be made better by the community in helping people there. and just as dst said she has 2 alts who did the same thing for over a year. but now that the alts are called lib it suddenly becomes a huge problem...

[No one]

No, it is not about "alts being called lib" , it is because it is a starting point for a new training ground.
And as you know, if one is given a finger, later will take all hand.


1. There simply has to forbid the "legally" created GGGs (training grounds, whatever form it may have).

2. If you want to do it for yourself, do it. Don't ever ask permission. Just assume responsibility for your actions.

3. The point is that organized places will eventually go to abuses that are not yet foreseen / foretold. If there is nothing legal, then there is no "legal" abuse.

So, if you do something, it will all be your responsibility and yours alone. There will no longer be an escape goat (it was there set by others / I did it for others). You did it , it is yours.



That would be the short and spoilerless version. Do try to understand it.

[Lifeline]

i disagree. training grounds are fine no matter if they are public established or not. abuse is always possible and of course open training grounds are more likely to produce abuse. but it can just as well be done in private if there is the will. the training grounds help people which is the big difference. the privat places only lead to abuse and the public ones to abuse and helping others. most people go into a martial arts school to learn how to defend themself but some only to attack others and hurt them. of course the martial arts school bring forth more abusing people as some hidden privat training grounds but martial arts schools arent banned by the goverment.
its pretty much the same here. help 10 people and with that support 2 abusers. or help nobody and get 1 abuser who trains secretly. plus there is also the possibility that it even encourages abusers to abuse even more because if they setup a privat training ground then they alone can abuse and nobody else(or just a very few people) which makes them even more superior.

[CrazyMike]

I do agree that there is a possibility of a training ground becoming another GGG.

There will always be training done by someone somewhere.

And with training, comes the possibility of abuse.

GoS is used for losing xp. No MP3 or MP4 will use that.

Only regen sets players idle there.

Only players who are combat active needs to lose xp there.

Nobody is gonna train on regen sets!

Sometimes a player might help out with setting up a rit to give away a win, but other than that, players still come in there and farm at everyone.

Nobody complains because there are no rules on players who are non regen. Its kill or be killed.

Having more regen rits there will lessen the need for players to stay there longer than required. Is that not good?

Again, there are no rules, no training, no idling to be farmed going on. Just losing xp!

[No one]

[quote name='Lifeline' date='12 July 2010 - 05:32 PM' timestamp='1278948743' post='63839']
i disagree. training grounds are fine no matter if they are public established or not. abuse is always possible and of course open training grounds are more likely to produce abuse. but it can just as well be done in private if there is the will. the training grounds help people which is the big difference. the privat places only lead to abuse and the public ones to abuse and helping others.
...
[/quote]
I didn't said not to do it. I just said not to make it legal. If it gets legal it is strict, it will raise complains, it ... is complicated.

If you want to set regen rits, just do it and from personal experience : do not set it in the middle of the road; do announce / remind the setting; do not let it run forever.


[quote name='CrazyMike' date='13 July 2010 - 05:03 AM' timestamp='1278990235' post='63852']
Nobody complains because there are no rules on players who are non regen. Its kill or be killed.
[/quote]
who said that regen rits cannot be farmed for stats ? with the proper ritual you can destroy that regen rit and get its stats.

As I said, as long as the location is by volunteering and not "legal" and enforced, it is ok.


Some of you already know of about my own & old DJLE / DLXP / Dojo of Lost Exp. It started more then 1 year ago when regen feature was introduced & understood. It worked perfect until GGG started to be over-abused and new & permanent DLXP were needed.

The setting was simple: out of the way / remote location; someone would announce the regen rits whenever the chat was full; the timing would be like every few days / max 2 times per week (not all day).
Reasons: protecting random ppl from attacking regen rits; limiting the abuse / over use of regen rits and thus trying to limit the stat grinders.