no decent proof of what DST? I see no decent proof that you won the quest. All you did was say that an item was a grail, and that someone had it. With no evidence to back it up, with not having visited clickies that were scripted to keep record of people who progressed to the final stage of the quest. So now that you can't prove you DID do the quest...since you haven't proven that at all. As is by the huge negative response you got from the community, i think they agree. If the council agrees it will be very evident to the community that what they think doesn't matter, but what the whining of a few who "didn't get a clear response".

I've hidden a bunch of spam posts here. Please refrain from posting if you're unable to add something to the arguments.

I see nowhere where you stated HOW the quest should have been solved. You only said: find the grail. And I did but because I did it way too fast for you and because I didn't do it the way YOU wanted you of course found a way not to declare me the winner.
As for my proofs, I will not show them to you or anyone else. I have sent them to the right persons. If they decide to make them public, so be it but for the time being I will not humor you. Eat your heart out.

Dst you said you found the grail, but never found anything but the UTOB trophy in my inventory. For all you knew it could have been a distraction, or something completely unrelated. That wasn't the case, but it could have been. At least that was the idea I got from our short PM exchange, and that's why you didn't win. When Duxie asked me if the trophy was the grail he didn't win either. After that it still took him some time till he found such undeniable proof that he was able to win.

Also I would like you to stop making vague accusation, based un nothing but assumptions like "PREVENT me from winning the quest by such low methods." As a mater of facts I have never received any instructions regarding you other than waiting for you to show proof, which I was already instructed to do before for everyone. You could have gained the proof just as easily as anyone else. Regarding to these accusations I would like to point to announcement 2017, as these false accusation, together with your claim you do not want the rewards, make it seem like you are only trying to start another scandal.

Last but not least it might be better for you to check what has been said earlier as Duxie will become a victim if you get your way, because you asked for the reward, which was well earned by lots of hard work, to be removed. Furthermore while maybe not everything said in my previous post has been emphasized enough I'm quite sure there is nothing wrong with it. if you are revering to my explanation on why I said what I said in my PMs I've already pointed that out earlier in the other topic.

EDIT:
P.s. from the timing I take public hangings have been planed to take place during the festival?

Edited April 11, 201214 yr by samon

I never asked you if the Grail was the trophy. Re-read our PM exchange. I STATED that it was.

You stated so, but it was nothing but a guess, which isn't worth more than asking.

Ok, it's pointless to discuss this anymore since you keep continuing to argue that you were just "following instructions" and "'I haven't had time to participate in the quest.'" which is clearly OOC and missleading.

There is NOWHERE stated that I had to bring proof. You have NEVER asked for proofs. You simlpy states the above.

phantasm found a way to get his revenge over me not helping him get back SoS from Eon. No problem. I can live with that especially since he now showed his true face.
You accuse meof being biased and vengecefull. Take a look on the mirror and then start talking. So far it's 1-0 for me since my case had good enogh proofs to catch the Council's attention while you all failed to bring anything else but yaps and excuses.

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]in fact your "proof" is equal to our "yaps" as it doesn't prove anything you [u]want[/u] to prove. and no, i don't need to see it to say so.[/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]as i already stated - your "proof" is not equal to our "yaps" [u]here[/u] just because you and "the right persons" you've sent your "proof" are more right then the rest.[/font][/size]

Then I guess all we can do for now is agree to disagree and wait for the council's decision.

You say you've found something while there was no final reason to conclude what you found actually was what you say it was. You say it doesn't matter because you didn't know you had to.

You found your way to attack Phantasm by trying to cheat the quest, quitting before actually trying anything serious and afterwards suing him for being unfair. So far it's 1-1 as we seem to have the community on our side, and honestly I care more for their opinion then for the councils. Still I hope they will make the right decision based on prove submitted by both sides and the "yaps" on the forum.

What duxie? You're afraid you'll lose your wishpoint? Don't talk about things you have never seen.
Yes samon, base yourself on the community. Wait...no, not on the community but on the people that hate me because 90% of them are afraid of me. You're not in the possition to talk for the whole MD population.
1-1? Really? You do realize that I can't care less about the opinions of the people you call "the community" aka the ones that hate me cause the other don't bother to actually care. Those losers found a way to get their revenge and they take advantage of it. That's cool. I don't mind since I understand it: it's easier to yap and throw dirt than actually think and see beyond their hate. For each one of them I can tell you a story on why they are on your side and not on mine.

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]"Don't talk about things you have never seen." - but that's exactly what you do here from the very beginning. you're stating that you were treated differently then others for this quest and this is your primary accusation, yet you have no proof of that. if you wan't to prove otherwise - do that instead of yapping. till then we're equal, and you can not forbid me to do the same you are doing [/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]"You're afraid you'll lose your wishpoint?" - no, and i've already told you few posts above in a technical person's manner what is bothering me, and it is not the wishpoint.[/font][/size]

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]anyways, i think you like those forum wars, and i must admit - i like them too so i guess we'll just continue to have our fun for those few days, heh...[/font][/size]

Could you please show me where I stated I was treated differently? Please read my posts and highlight where I stated that.

I hate to stir up and stick my foot in this trouble, but the way I see it there is simply a disagreement in terms.

DST is correct, the quest originally stated "find the grail". She had done so, by the 'letter of the rules' provided.
She is incorrect in the "spirit of the rules", but did not know of the additional and hidden requirements of clicking and such.
She also has not asked for the "winning" reward. Merely acceptance that she "found it first", from what I see.

Phantasm is correct in that he designed the quest, and set things up so that there were roadblocks, and requirements to provide "Proof" of the finding.
He is incorrect in assuming folks would pursue the full measure of hidden clickies and questioning of Samon in the face of an initial "misdirection" on his part. I appreciate how Rp-wise, it was intended to be difficult. However, it's easy to claim "obviously try harder" in hindsight. Had I been doing the quest, I probably would have looked elsewhere after being told "nope, not me".


I don't have an answer for who is "right anad proper" in this case, and do not envy the Council this case.
It's a matter of semantics, the way I see it. Putting aside the bias and accusations of "revenge", the facts as I see them are still foggy and subjective.

The rules were/are somewhat unclear, or at the least open to interpretation.

Agree to disagree, if you must, but continued sniping at each other here, doesn't add value IMHO. The facts are out there, let those looking at them closely decide something.

(I'm guessing Council is pretty busy right now with MD birthday coming up too, but that's off-topic)

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]ok, i am sorry for my wording. let me rephrase: you're stating that you were treated "unfair", and that would be possible only when others were treated differently, for what again - you have no proof.[/font][/size]

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]here are your words: [/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]" Thanks to you and phantasm for proveing you know what [b]fair[/b] play means. hope you see the [b]quotes[/b] on that statement. "[/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]" I simply HATE to see such [b]lack of fair play[/b] and [b]discrimination[/b]! ". [/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]" ... I am upset that you are [b]unfair [/b]..."[/font][/size]

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]there are more in the context, but you would call it a yapping once again, and my yapping doesn't go to the sky differently from yours.[/font][/size]

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]and here are the council words from which everyone can see that the accusation is all about unfair, different treatment: [/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]" We have had no evidence to demonstrate how Samon treated participants of this quest [b]fairly [/b]as his responses to PMs no longer exist "[/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]" From the evidence we have seen it seems like dst was treated [b]unfairly[/b] ..."[/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]" We are asking one final time for anyone to submit relevant evidence to show [b]fair[/b] treatment of participants of the quest "[/font][/size]

[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]from the council statement it is clearly visible that neither you, nor council has any evidence showing how other players were treated. so how come your assumptions are enough for the case?[/font][/size]
[size=3][font=verdana,geneva,sans-serif]tell me now - why can you throw such accusations and see your yapping somehow better then others? tell me also this - do you believe that if it was not [u]your[/u] yapping, would the council treat it the same way? you do not need to answer, i've seen the treatment of similar accusations from lots of other people. now that's what i call unfair, that's what i call different, that's what i call double standards and discrimination.[/font][/size]

iv been away, this has all blown completely out of proportion. I dont care what the council think, im closing this for now. Sue me.

send anything you want to the council, this is not solving anything by posting this stuff here

[cquote]Dst may not have met the requirements to win due to the quest's hidden aspect, however due to the PMs received and how they were worded she would not have any reason to continue hunting as it seemed as if Samon wasn't even part of the quest. There has been no proof sent to us that anyone else received that style of treatment from Samon, or that they received any other style of treatment either. Testimony is weighed to the side that everyone was treated in this way and as this is the only balancing evidence no punishment will ensue.

For this instance, it should be noted that it does not seem entirely fair that the reply was sent in such an OOC way, and more reasonable responses should be considered.[/cquote]