Plains of Liberty turned into Plains of Everlasting Stench

[dst]

So, as for quite some time now the location 7_plains_1 has had the subtitle changed from Plainf of Liberty to Plains of Everlasting Stench.

Does anyone know WHY? Was there any RP or anything that would ask for such a nasty change?

Also, is this legal? In my opinion is not, because it breaks the rules set in the Wish Description:

[b]Change location subtitle[/b]
Allows you to change a subtitle on a given location. The new title will remain forever untill someone else changes it and for at least 4 days. With this you can mark locations to support your role, such as pubs, markets, themed gathering places, mark historic locations to remember an important event for all future players, organise group activities, support role play situations, etc. You are not allow to write playernames in this subtitle. Abusing this by writing ofences, advertising or similar will be penalised.



Opinions?

[Jubaris]

Not to say too much, will keep it to a minimum.
I am against the new name, I want for the old one to be brought back, but I don't see where the rules were broken. Those 4 days of minimum subtitle standing passed, and it was free to be changed. Nobody was said that the new subtitle HAS to be backed by RP, it is just an option. Besides, the very original name broke the rule of the wish description (player name used), but, since it was made by Mur...

Again, I want the old name back but I would also like a good clarification on the rules.

[Kaya]

I do find it offensive towards the Tribunal and it's citizens though, imagine me naming your front garden Plains of Everlasting Stench. At least I think it should fall in the "similar" category and it doesn't fit with the suggested uses.

It's a bit of a grey area, but I prefer to see it removed/reset.

Edit: Unless there is a good reason it's called like this, in which I probably still won't like it, but there is no real problem.

Edited November 23, 2012 by samon

[Liberty4life]

rhaegar, rule IS broken, i will quote
[quote name='dst' timestamp='1353681408' post='126122']Abusing this [color=#ff0000]by writing ofences[/color], advertising or similar will be penalised.
[/quote]

for those of you who dont know, name of location was put by mur during exploration of east (opening event for tribunal and unwritten part of al), and he put it as double meaning(due to my name) for sake of
[quote]mark historic locations to remember an important event for all future players[/quote]

so i do find it as direct insult to both myself and community

moreover change of name cant be justified since at that place nothin related to "everlasting stench" roleplay ever occured (if it did, if somebody actually actively practicized role based on ... idk breeding farting grasans at that location, then it might have been justified name change, but since nothin of similar nature ever happened the only reason for name change was to obviously insult)

i sent email to council last week, i would open topic about this myself by end of this week if council wouldnt act, till now still no reply from them

[I am Bored]

As a note to all, if nobody can give a good reason for it having it's current name within a week, I'll spend a wishpoint and change it back.

[phantasm]

i brought this issue up a while back about another scene "The Road to Eros. in the TB being changed and having a "alice in wonderland overtone" and it was shot down saying that people can "do what they want". It was never changed, so I don't see why this one should be any different. That scene had no bearing upon anyone's RP or for that matter any bearing at all.

I do agree that it is wrong and that BOTH scenes should be changed. As IAB pointed out though, most likely the only way it will be changed is through other people "wasting" their WP to change it back.

[Liberty4life]

i brought up road to eros too, however things are a bit different here

in both cases names were put up for historical purpose

difference is, in this case it is put as an insult, if it got renamed into Plains of Love or somethin alike then there wouldnt be any basis for complaint

its pretty clear that reason for name changed by unknown person was to insult, s/he pretty much said that Liberty=Everlasting Stench, and since that person who changed name didnt spoke up anywhere about this name change, then its obvious its all about insult, if person had any good intentions/reasons for namechange s/he would speak up but instead s/he decided to remain silent becoz why would s/he stand up if his/her intention is to insult

i wonder wut would you do if your name got equalized with everlasting stench? wouldnt you get insulted? thats clear breakin of rule for scene name change

[Fang Archbane]

[quote name='phantasm' timestamp='1353756844' post='126167']
As IAB pointed out though, most likely the only way it will be changed is through other people "wasting" their WP to change it back.
[/quote]

Well, i wouldnt call it WASTING a WishPoint, but thats a personal opinion i guess.

And this is for the world to hear. Since the area was named after Liberty4Life by Mur, for whatever reason, the Treasure Keepers would be more than happy to gift him one WishPoint to change it back. And this will keep happening every time someone insults a fellow player by committing such an act and mindlessly losing WishPoints.

Just tell me if the Council dont change it back for free Lib. No matter what, the Treasure Keepers have your back on this one.

Side-Note: And before anyone says it, yes, i know, giving him one WishPoint for "free" to change this would get him deeper in the WishShop. Well that just sucks for everyone but Liberty doesnt it? Maybe you should bring it up with whomever changed the name to Stench, and complain to HIM/HER.

And unless i get some kind of fat no from the Council as to my doing this, its going to happen whether others complain or not (save for one or two people whos opinions actually matter to me).

[Chewett]

[quote name='Fang Archbane' timestamp='1353767643' post='126181']
Well, i wouldnt call it WASTING a WishPoint, but thats a personal opinion i guess.

And this is for the world to hear. Since the area was named after Liberty4Life by Mur, for whatever reason, [b]the Treasure Keepers would be more than happy to gift him one WishPoint to change it back. [/b]And this will keep happening every time someone insults a fellow player by committing such an act and mindlessly losing WishPoints.

Just tell me if the Council dont change it back for free Lib.[b] No matter what, the Treasure Keepers have your back on this one.[/b]

Side-Note: And before anyone says it, yes, i know, giving him one WishPoint for "free" to change this would get him deeper in the WishShop. Well that just sucks for everyone but Liberty doesnt it? Maybe you should bring it up with whomever changed the name to Stench, and complain to HIM/HER.

And unless i get some kind of fat no from the Council as to my doing this, its going to happen whether others complain or not (save for one or two people whos opinions actually matter to me).
[/quote]

This is wrong on so many levels but fang has been allowed to abuse what he wants and no one gives a

Edited November 24, 2012 by Chewett

[Liberty4life]

discussion in here is not about scene gettin renamed back into plains of liberty, its about insulting ppl

if only way to remove is to use wp, then ty all we can all close this topic at once, since thats easy to do it only costs one useless wp

i dont have issue with scene gettin renamed, i have issue with scene gettin renamed in offensive manner, name that location as you wish

if council doesnt cares, then i would prefer for it to stay named as it is, as permanent scar on face of md as a reminder that this is place where you can easily insult others and get away with it

[Valldore Nal]

I totally agree with Chewett on this one.

Even if you have the feeling that this change was unjust or offensive, your position does not allow you to grand WP just because you don't like something and you want it changed. (at least that's the way i see the position of TK leader, your position is not to be used to correct what you perceive wrong and unjust. If Fang wants to correct something wrong and unjust, do it as Fang, not as the TK leader )

And as far as it concerns the subtitle, i do find it offensive towards LotE in general and Liberty (when i first saw the post i would have said that the first name was against the rule as well, but i didn't know the history of that so since it was done during an event and by Mur i no longer see anything wrong with the previous subtitle) .

Also, as the rule states , an action like that should be penalised as well. So if people doesn't like the rule, petition for it to change. But as long as it stands, it should be enforced.

P.S. Until the time this post was made, no clarification about the reasoning of that change was made. If there is one that stands and is not offensive either to LotE in general or Liberty, it may still be seen as offensive in my personal opinion, but the accusation of braking a rule may not stand anymore.

Edited November 24, 2012 by Valldore Nal

[ZenTao]

Fang says
[quote]Just tell me if the Council dont change it back for free Lib. No matter what, the Treasure Keepers have your back on this one.[/quote]

While I understand that Fang doesn't like this name change, I would like to encourage him to remember to keep his feelings at a halt when basing decisions he makes in the name of the Treasure Keepers. It's not fair of Fang to put an opinion out speaking on the TK's behalf when other members are unaware of it. The way I see it, being a Treasure Keeper does not entitle someone to some higher authority, it's a job in the service of MD and the community and that is it!

[Fang Archbane]

Its not like it matters. Liberty has stated that if it doesn't get changed by Council, hed rather it stay as a blatant scar. That's fine with me. It was his scene after all.

[DARK DEMON]

No One has already posted that he'll spend his wishpoint to change it back.

Yet, nobody is talking about that and whether he'll actually do it.
Yet, Fang posts that, "No, the TK's will do it!"
Yet, you all argue about it so much?

Why?

[No one]

@Dark: I said no such thing.
But I do am sorry for you being caught in this.

As Lib said above, this topic is about insulting titles. If we are starting to overlook this part of the rule, then who is to say that tomorrow GoE or any of the capitols will not have a similar title?

I vote for the punishment of whoever changed the title at least by removing 1 extra WP to change it back or to clear the title.

If these words "everlasting-stench" will not be considered as an insult, then I will ask for the name of the one that changed the title and I will personally post in its personal log the "everlasting-stench" as , as I said, these words will not be considered as an insult and I will even spend a WP for the title of that person to be changed to "everlasting-stench".

Edited November 26, 2012 by No one

[DARK DEMON]

[quote name='No one' timestamp='1353927686' post='126453']
@Dark: I said no such thing.
But I do am sorry for you being caught in this.
[/quote]

Oops, I'm SO sorry!

I meant that I am Bored would spend it... lol

[Grido]

Question, other than speculation, is there anything to suggest that it was meant as insulting? Has anyone insinuated, have you heard any rumours or anything along those lines, to say that it was indeed done as a means of insulting Lib?

Granted, that the person who did it hasn't stepped forward and said why they did it, doesn't look good for them, but with the threats/attacks towards this person being throughout the thread, if they are not wanting to confront those, then it may be justified in not coming forward.

At the end of the day, the scene that's referred to is a Plain, if there was indeed some RP or other that reflected someone farting a lot and they wanted to add it in a permanent (humorous) way to that scene, or someone wanted to set up a role as a sewage treatment person, who are we to prevent them from doing that? And both of these options, and more, would be perfectly valid reasons for the current scene subtitle.

Just because you don't know the reason for the change, doesn't mean that it must be the one that is considered insulting.

[dst]

Then, according to your logic Greedo, I can go inside GG and name one of the scenes there hmm...Public Toilet and even stick some napkins in there.

[Grido]

You would have the right to do so, yes.

[Seigheart]

I have to agree with Grido. This isn't as bad as it seems. Yes, you may find it insulting, but the name change could have easily been done by someone who has no idea why it was called the Plains of Liberty.

It could be that they had a big rp there with some grassans and wanted to remember it.

dst, isn't it your job to monitor the logs? I'm pretty sure you could find out if you actually did that since the WP page says how someone spent their WPs

[dst]

If you ALL read my first post, I asked WHY not who.

[Liberty4life]

[quote name='Grido' timestamp='1353933855' post='126473']
Question, other than speculation, is there anything to suggest that it was meant as insulting? Has anyone insinuated, have you heard any rumours or anything along those lines, to say that it was indeed done as a means of insulting Lib?

Granted, that the person who did it hasn't stepped forward and said why they did it, doesn't look good for them, but with the threats/attacks towards this person being throughout the thread, if they are not wanting to confront those, then it may be justified in not coming forward.

At the end of the day, the scene that's referred to is a Plain, if there was indeed some RP or other that reflected someone farting a lot and they wanted to add it in a permanent (humorous) way to that scene, or someone wanted to set up a role as a sewage treatment person, who are we to prevent them from doing that? And both of these options, and more, would be perfectly valid reasons for the current scene subtitle.

Just because you don't know the reason for the change, doesn't mean that it must be the one that is considered insulting.
[/quote]

exactly that, thing is why wouldnt that person step up and say what was reason for change especially after few ppl offered wp to change it back, with iab sayin it publically, it makes no sense to me that one would use wp to change name, and then not state a reason why it should stay when it arise such a big fuss, and even after me sayin that i have no issues with it being changed, my only issue is that i find it offending, if they can back up name change with real thing, np let it stay fine with me

thing is that such behaviour obviously indicates that goal was to insult me

[Seigheart]

Or, is ignorant on who Liberty is. It's not like Liberty is active IG anymore

[Grido]

[quote name='Liberty4life' timestamp='1353950720' post='126501']...thing is why wouldnt that person step up and say what was reason for change especially after few ppl offered wp to change it back...[/quote][quote name='Grido' timestamp='1353933855' post='126473']...with the threats/attacks towards this person being throughout the thread, if they are not wanting to confront those, then it may be justified in not coming forward.[/quote]

[Liberty4life]

and i quote you this
[quote name='Liberty4life' timestamp='1353950720' post='126501']
if they can back up name change with real thing, np let it stay fine with me
[/quote]