Ivorak

Oh! Poor ,poor, Lifeline , i can almost see you crying , pity him he got his toys removed.... i;m sure he;ll get new ones if he works hard enough!

Insanely heavy punishment?
Are you kidding me? You lost a spell and a king point. Do you consider that heavy? Omg....I'm speechless.

And do you really think you can play the "innocent" I did not know, I don't read the forum , I hate the forum part to get away with it?

[quote name='Pipstickz' timestamp='1290560121' post='72964']
You need to be in the same location as the chat you want to pull with the chatlog spell.
[/quote]

that still don't answer how it isn't an intrusion on kingdoms? or the one about using spells how they were made? like i say i am more or so interested how that double standard works here? i think she isn't a king or queen?? but still she can use that spell any place she goes. since she is part of underground?? using it outside of underground isn't an intrusion?

also where you not the one who had said in a prior topic about that drach cave, the punishment was only for taking a drach out of it not for being there? which is exactly what i think everyone who was involved thought. if a spot is closed so you can't remove something from it, then the thing you can remove from it is removed, don't this negate the reason it was closed in the first place??

chew can u please change the name of the topic into what mur suggested "Lifeline Vs Decision In The Drach Lair Incident" i cant do that. thanks in advance

EDIT: need to add something more because this is what this is about the rules and restrictions. really have a look at them and u will see that especially the bold or red rules were offended very often and that the violators either got no punishment at all or were really light ones. the rules really cover a lot like impersonation of other players. how then can players get hugely punished without a trial, their voices being heard, their case properly investigated, ect for something that not only never appears in the rules but also never in the announcements? i will keep stressing masterb case here because i see no reason at all for him to be guilty of anything. that recruiting crits u shouldnt be able to isnt allowed makes sense just on a common sense basis. but that a few locations are offlimit or what this seems to really be about restricted to only a certain number of players is never mentioned anywhere. and mur said so himself the crime was having LOTS of people inside the lair just 1 or 2 would have been no problem at all. and that truely is never even mentioned anywhere including forums. so all i am doing here is asking for a warning instead a punishment. a warning that still results into a kingship penality point for me but nothing else especially for the people i teleported.

@ chew

"So if you lose you will be perma banned?"
yes and once again this is no bluff. if i will not get banned i will make sure to pass along kingship and let the player lifeline die in MD.

"Your defence is:..."
mostly yes. main point is that the rules cover a lot like how rude language/insults and slander is bannable, mentions wishpoints abuse, swearing, and almost everything u can think about but never offlimit locations in general. the rules state several things as crimes dst commits over and over again but something for what people get hugely punished for isnt even mentioned. and once again best example is masterb here. he didnt even know he would end up in drach lair. a minute after i summoned him in he left and teled back to papercabin.
and for me the way every incident in the drach lair got handled shows very clearly that RJ still kept his authority and owns the place. if not even the gg king can enter then yes i believe RJ is the highest authority to ask there(expect mur of course). i simply had no reasons to not believe what RJ told me.
as for what i want if i win this trial please refer to my orginal post it is said very clearly there.

@ Tipu
thank u very much for the support i am really touched but please think about it very clearly. u now have a clear mission to carry out, how i handle this situation is my way of living so please dont rush into something u might regret.

[quote name='Metal Bunny' timestamp='1290512683' post='72893']
As a king, no, as an experienced player, you should've contacted either the staff beforehand, or Yrthilian.
We may not have treaties set up between MB and GG, but I assure you, it looks insulting.
[/quote]

i apologized to yrth and explained the situation but if i have to again then here very quickly: gg king has no access to the lair, RJ does so i thought RJ is the authority to contact. and please read the new announcement maybe then u can see that it was easy to make a mistake there.
and now no offense but it looked insulting? when burns boldly posted a gg recruitment poster in the middle of MB without ever asking me i didnt go to war. i even kindly ask him to simply move it outside of MB. and guess what after that another incident where gg citizen overstepped land borders. burns actually sets up the fight club at the park while i was planning something there myself. once again he never asked me and i only kindly told him to move it somewhere else because i had an own dojo planned. i mean no offense here but i am really surprised how 3 leaders of golemus keep tellng me i insulted their land, stepped on their toes, ect and in the past a gg leader did worse to MB and all i did was kindly notice him that it is a land under a king and not their playfield. come on a recruitment poster for gg alliance in the heart of MB without ever asking me? what is that?! but anyway lets forget about all that and concentrate on the trial here. i certainly do not wish to bring up old problems (they are past and gone) or endanger my friendship to golemus. so lets just move on and not bring it up anymore.


@ many other people please read the rules and restrictions ingame it seems u never did. it is amazing how many things are covered in there that even get violated on a consistant basis but are never punsihed or very lightly even if the rules say its forbidden in bold big red.


[quote name='Muratus del Mur' timestamp='1290519477' post='72903']
- You are ready to lose everything over this, makes me think how "much" you value what you have

You as a king have the enormous advantage that you can ask me anything directly, you didnt.
For me its clear, in the perspective of personal advantage you pretended to not know, but once this turned against you you try to pose as a victim. Most of the other details were covered by others in their replies.

And note, if you ever play so easy about ban requests , i will grant you this "wish". If you don't care about your own character in md , why should I?
[/quote]

i currently have little internet and even have to pay for it (i actually write all this MD stuff offline and just log into the inet to post it). my personal advantage out of a training ground? i didnt even use the place i left it without a single attack. nor could i have used it for at least 2 months because i have no time at all and probaly not afterwards as well (oh and after 2 months dst would have surely managed to destroy it). and now please everybody think about this if i knew i was doing something bad why go into drach lair? i could have gone to fields of fear even much more easly. that would have been a save location at least until the next torch competetion. but i am sick of trying to proof that anymore the important people have decided i am an abuser well fine then let them be my guest.
how i value stuff... let me explain a small fraction of my name what it means. and now this is truely only the smallest part of it. Life line - living on the line in a constant embrace with death. its about the present moment the only thing i believe truely exists. so what i value is the present not the past that is gone and not the future that doesnt exists yet.
dont make this about what i value or not there is only value for the present - the gift that is the same to all. it matters not if i am a king or newbie in the aspect of value. we all got the very same power to influence this very moment and thats all one can ever really claim.
i dont care about my character in MD just because i embrace death? death is merely the stripping away of everything that isnt myself. and myself is not a person that will tolerate laws and rules that are handled like this. so yes strip that away from me and with that allow me to become who i truely am.
(i ment everything i said and if this trial results in the death of the player lifeline then i hope it was for something that made an impact and gave life to an improved system that will ensure better handling)
(oh and i didnt ask u personally because i thought RJ was allowed to invite people inside and if for every possibly bad choice i could have made as king i would have ask u u would have been very busy with me. the only game i play since 2 years is MD and besides that i have a very tight schedule myself so i can perfectly understand that u have no time and respect ur time. i will say it again i HAD CONCERNS but after listening to RJ i was convinced its all fine)


[quote name='Indyra' timestamp='1290524472' post='72914']
@ Lifeline : if i would have started a training grup in Champions Dome or inside the Angien Shrine - would you go quiet if i didn;t ask your approval before i did it ?[/quote]

i already excused burns twice to what u people urself call violation of a land. and yes champ dome would have been no problem i would have messaged u that i am disappointed about not being ask (note i appologized to yrth) but would let ur training ground be there. why shouldnt i? its a good project that helps PLAYERS which in my opinion is much more important than land and territory.

Wow, Get home and already at page 2. Good Job...

If the rules are obviously not clear enough, i shall add to them. If you want more and more restrictions and cannot understand the rules then fine, i shall specify many more rules to try and make up for the lack of comprehension.

[b]Forum Signatures must be in English, As this is the forum language[/b]

There is no discussion. There will be a weeks Grace period where we will start contacting you to get it changed, once this is over we will start removing them ourselves.

If you wish to talk to me about this, Pm/yim/email but i will not change my mind.

[size="5"][b]Sidenote: About Material people find offensive[/b][/size]

Normally because we try and keep the forum a happy place, if someone finds something offensive and rude we try and find a happy medium by contacting the person who posted whatever to see if they dont mind changing the wording.

If there are several comments about it, it will likely be removed immediately or changed and the member contacted.

If I may. I get that the signature is probably a veiled attempt at poking fingers at certain people in MD. However, I don't really care to be honest.
Yes, the forum is supposed to use English, but some people don't use it 100% and to be honest, I think that in 99.9% of cases nobody would complain at all.
What I'd really like to see is the sig translated into English properly. If someone is trying to insult me or anyone else I'd like them to have the decency to do it properly
If its not an attempt at a snide insult, well same goes really. If I don't understand it, I can't feel paranoid that its somehow a message for me
I think that they should just remove or translate it to English, I don't think its cause for punishment.

Your signature photo must be removed, or resized, it violates one of the forum rules:

- Signature pictures may not exceed following rules: Height: 150px Width: 500px File size: 50kb.

This is an international forum, therefore international language to be used, aka english and not offensive.
Princ knows very well this rule as he posted injurring texts on the mod panel long ago and got warned for that and explained that only english to be used; aka we are speaking about a player that violated the forum rules more times in the past.

Exepcions can be, ofc the scientific names/expressions, like the one i have for the tomato, wich is 1 word, not a volume of offensive text.


Nobody said this is dictatorship, but it is a forum and has rules, rules that must be respected or else we, the mods/admins will enforce them in order to keep the forum clean off all sorts of misery that some can bring in.

[quote name='dst' timestamp='1290501796' post='72870']
You miss the whole point.
I'll explain it again rarely this time:
[/quote]
No, I see what her argument is, as indicated by my first post to this thread.

[quote name='dst' timestamp='1290501796' post='72870']
English is the only allowed language in the forum.


Those 2 put something in another language. First offense.
[/quote]
And I have brought up the following:
I consider the signatures short enough to be phrases (both because of their length and because they are sayings by someone else), by your own admission, phrases are acceptable.
Both Akasha and I have posted something in another language in this very thread, yet why is that not a breach? Because it's obvious you mgiht say? Well since is not qualified in the rules , it IS a breach.
My argument is that since [b]signatures[/b] containing other languages is not explicitly forbidden, why are our posts exempted when also lacking a rule?
And while on that matter, what is a song or video in a another language is posted on the forum?


[quote name='dst' timestamp='1290501796' post='72870']
If someone curious enough goes and translates the words he/she discovers they are full of insults. Second offense.
[/quote]
And they would see that it was a song, not an attack on them. What you are saying is they find the words offensive, not the fact that it was directed at them. Well then what if someone finds your above post offensive? The whole matter is subjective. And while I agree that it can be interpreted as offensive, I do not feel a ban would be applicable for the specific words in this case, nor do I feel than anything more than a warning to the involved parties is required.

[quote name='dst' timestamp='1290501796' post='72870']
And I think Akasha state what SHE will do. That's her opinion. She's entitled to it. And she already said that "their fate" will be decided by the GROUP of mods.
[/quote]
Certainly she is entitled to her opinion, and I to mine, and Rheagar and Ravenstrider to theirs.
I presented a refutation and all I asked for was a motivation for her reasoning, which has not been provided.

[quote name='dst' timestamp='1290501796' post='72870']
Clearer now?
[/quote]
As shown from my above replies, I do not feel that there was any misunderstanding on my behalf but rather on yours

Your arguments are fair, but I have a quibble. I don't think that veterans who have spent years learning and exploring should share their knowledge freely. For one, newbies would misinterpret it without the proper background, and for another it would be devalued. That which is given is forgotten, while that which is built lasts forever.

The solution to the problem of hopeless groping might rest more in an ingame location which people can come and speak about anything and everything, under the watchful eyes of those of us who have spent far too much time sitting around thinking up theories.

I don't wish to name a specific location, because I think that organically one will be chosen without effort, but I do welcome any people to stop by me and talk. If I'm around, I will respond.

In short: rather than a lecture, there should be an eternal conversation.

Awi

It all comes down to spoilers. If spoilers could be avoided, I would be in favor.

For example, I think it would be helpful as a newcomer to know about the constant day. There are many small, but important, details about these lands that I forget from time to time.

Now, the above example would only help those who showed up unless, of course, logs were taken or summaries written.

Also, why limit it to those topics that are specifically MD? I think it is possible to avoid anachronisms and out of character chatter if we discuss such fields as philosophy, mathematics, etc. In some cases, these discussions could be tied to MD with a little planning.

As for a location, I would suggest the Underway Cavern. Long ago, this location was proposed for the Phrontistery ("A Thinking Place") as it is almost central in MD but removed from the noise and bustle of the other central scenes.

@yrth: Uh, the topic title is misleading... I'm rubbish at naming things. This was mainly what I had in mind... Discussions about ideas and personal viewpoints on things... Maybe Free Thought Movement would be more appropriate as a name...

Not giving knowledge as in: "Here, this is what I know", but more: Here is my viewpoint on this, here is an idea about a direction concerning that, etc. Something that would maybe cause people to step back and reexamine their own personal research... One man can only do so much without someone to discuss things with...


And yes, I know this would be very hard to maintain, and organize... This is why I opened the topic, to see how people would react to it and would they be willing to participate...

And once again, I wasn't thinking about talking about sensitive information like land weapons... But something like: Why don't some people need food to survive in MD and why do some do? (I'm quite tired atm, so I can't think of anything better) And no, the discussions wouldn't be limited to MD, they could go in various directions...

[quote name='Grido' timestamp='1290118706' post='72514']
The sparring grounds doesn't have rules that she's able to break, never mind whether she'd want to or not. Anyone who dst can attack in the sparring grounds, she's allowed to attack by the rules. All she's doing at the other training sites is attacking the people she's able, and posting the location they're at if they're persistent. SG is at a location everyone knows, so no point stating it, and she does attack everyone she's able there. So I don't think you have a point about that....
[/quote]

grido i think your missing my whole thing here, who cares if sparing grounds has rules she can break. if you don't like the idea of rules binding to combat it should include all spots and all MP levels. if you think this whole thing is about her want to only focus on rules for mp 5 levels i say that's stupid. the game isn't about dst, so just to say oh someone made a rule dst finds annoying then we should call it out makes me laugh. what it does show is that she has a big head as the game surely isn't about appeasing dst !

We don't care unless you show it to us now, this very minute. Since you researched this, you know how long it took for the previous trial to finish...

I would like to hereby formally charge dst with Excessive Harassment, Stalking, and Slander. When I started almost a year ago, I was relatively unknown, I had stopped playing for a few months. As most of you are well aware, dst has taken it upon herself to constantly accuse me of being someone I am not. She has also taken it upon herself to constantly follow me, to use her abilities to read through private conversations with her Acoustic Remains ability, and then post these logs on the forum.

Yes, the game mechanics allow her to do this. I accept that. But there is a point to which is acceptable, calling up chat logs for events, ceremonies, and speeches, and then there is calling up chat logs at private locations to find dirt on people when there is absolutely no cause for such an action.

Therefore, I would like to charge dst with these accusations, I will submit my proof, and witnesses to the proper authority when asked to. I would also like to request that the Judge to be a Neutral party.

If I am correct, dst got to suggest a punishment for Fenrir in the last trial and I would like to do the same. I would like dst’s Acoustic Remains to be removed, since she does not use it for its intended use, and a jail time of one month for her account due to a very similiar situation that arose between Fenrir Greycloth and dst previously.

I have continuously tried to be reasonable with this woman, but she purposely goes out of her way to harass me for absolutely no real reason.

Just cause i'm curious, what the hell does GGG have to do with fenrir or seigheart? Are you that paranoid that you need to make up alter egos against other people and cause problems? There should only be one topic here and thats GGG so your secondary statement should be deleted for stupidity


oh by the way, that logs shows nothing other than you are stalking people in game and people should call you an std. So thanks for blowing your own spot up stalker, you should be thrown in jail for abusing powers and stalking people for no reason.

Sparrhawk, you speak before thinking. This isn't an elitist club. It's a bunch of weak players trying to level up their creatures so that they may function properly in the game.

As you know, I am the Mushroom Worshiping Crazy Lady that chases after Z with a net in hand and... yeah anyway.

I was thinking after having a wonderful conversation thingy with Burnsy, that:
There should be a Mushroom Cult!!

I already worship my mushroom... I just need other believers to make it official. We were thinking of just having Mushroom ceremonies/sacrifices to Shroomy and overall causing Mushroom havoc against the Nightshade users and Bob lovers of which have deserted Shroomy!
Maybe someday when we are strong... we can shed the blood of the Tomato Cult...

As always, I want people's ideas on such an idea before really going forth with it. So.. please tell me whatcha think.


Please note that this is unofficial and is completely something to do for fun.

I originally suggested a sort of interface integrated vote where if enough citizens (not alts) voted against the king for another candidate that it would trigger an election. Although here the rebels themselves can in theory 'trigger an election by their presence', I'm not sure how this would be done save on the whim of a passing coder who happened to walk by and see some rebels gathered since there's no official rebel-to-citizen ratio count system, and so with nothing formally in place it clearly isn't very reliable. Now, if a rating meter were to become that trigger (say a certain percentage of discontent triggered a vote), I suppose it could work that way, but to me that seems too random since discontent could reach any level at any time with no prepared opponent against the king.

Another issue is who would vote and who would get to rate the monarch? To me, logically, only the citizens of a land would get to vote/rate, but in the past the entire land has gotten to vote on a specific land's monarch. Why are non-citizens getting to vote on a monarch whose rule they would not have to be under? If all of MD likes one person and yet the land's actual citizens like another, the rest of the land could shaft the citizens' votes and yet not have to live with it where the citizens DO. I'd like to request that if there IS some sort of vote that gets triggered in whatever fashion that it stay in-house- aka just to the citizens of the land to which the monarch applies. Non-citizens would not be under the rule of the winner, and therefore shouldn't have a say in what will so profoundly affect the citizens of the land having the vote.



[size="1"]edited for clairfication[/size]

*edit* Keeping the chat with Azull:

[quote]and more creative ways to punish rebels while keeping their purpose as a rebel.[/quote]

The rebel tag could have a time frame, and this tag
will expire if the rebel do not get more citizens to
his cause.

For each citizen added for the cause, no alt, the
duration of the tag will become longer, untill the
half of the number of citizens be reached, with that
the time frame won't work anymore and now, the king and
his supporters will have to take a move: war, elections
or negotiate with the rebels.

[quote]anonimous but public complain system, addressed to the king (only to him), is something i agree it could be usefull. not many have the courage to speak their mind freely, but their ideas might be usefull. It also prevents the king from saying no just because of his ego.

For now see how yould manage that with what it is...untill i figure something like a feature for it.[/quote]


This idea is completely imperfect but is everything that
me and Azull was able to come in the end. We are posting
because that has the chance to someone else has a better
idea with this imperfect suggestion.

A person could be named to be the bridge from
the citizen who wants complaining and the
king/government. With that said citizen can complaining with
the Bridge, and this person could talk with the king of the
land, in the name of the anonimous citizen.

This idea goes on, but has teh chance to become a new feature,
so we stop to say it at this point.

PS: [size="3"][b]we know this confidant has to be a special person, who is
trusted by the people[/b][/size]

[quote]next to be done is a way to see percentage of discontent in a land[/quote]

This came after a talk with Azull:

Mya's idea is good, but the king has the right to know
the reason why people are unhappy with his governement,
therefore for this purpose could be used the Post Office
system, that Chewett placed in front of the Willow shop a
while ago. Once this allows the citizen find the king's
ears even when he is not on the pre-rebel's Friend list.

The person receiving the letter could be named by King
if he is very busy.

Instead of creating a guild that is occupied only with water, why not have freelancers whom that besides taking care to collect and purify water also engage in making beverages such as soda and other alcohol?

And the drinks could be as consumable items. Having one manufacturer responsible for each land, so that each one would have the opportunity to produce its own and different beverages, with the characteristics of that land, made with properties of its own environment.

And the different lands could exchange their consumables with each other, regulated by international laws of trade or just like is made with the Sunny Bedroom keys.

Of course, everything combined with the water related matters as well, like purifing and handling.

I dislike that military take overs ain't possible.

So called "diplomacy" falls down to having people that are relatively close to Mur that can lobby to force some kind of change, and so called "diplomacy" has nothing to do with the gameplay. Rebels are supposed to fill some kind of non-written requirements so their demands can be fulfilled... pfff.
Please make some basic rules on what can be expected of the feature without divine intervention.

I think that the possibility of a military take over should be possible, also it can be used in land wars (most probably and for the best as well is that all kings maintain some kind of status quo when its about territory issues, but it is pretty logical that in an RP world that tries to make realistic environment and feedback it should be allowed for some King to mark his new territory and kick all the rest who defy him if he's strong enough to)

I just find this "king immunity" concept ridiculous... Kings of certain groups are chosen from those groups, and it is up to the people to follow the person... To overthrow (if have enough power to) or serve if they want... But the system favors the king rather than any other group.
Those roles shouldn't be called Kings at least, but Moderators of Mainlands.

I fail to see the reasoning behind those who are rebelling(totally a pun ) against the 4 hour chat ban.

If you are rebelling against your king, the king has absolute power over you while you are a citizen of their Land. That means, if he wished it, you would be beheaded. This is not a democrasy people. It's a dictatorship(technically a monarchy, but you get the idea). Yes, the Kings were elected at first, but the Kingship is now being passed along to people of the King's choosing. Yes, the King has to choose wisely or the populace will replace him, but still is a Monarchy/Dictatorship.

When the King says "Jump." You don't sit there and debate with him whether or not you should do it, you immediately do it.

I don't know if this is just me, but the King's need powers to enforce their rules. The populace needs an official way to dethrone a King. Instead of whining about how long a chatban is, ask yourselves who are you planning on overthrowing that it could effect you. Don't annoy the King, and don't become a Traitor to the Land. If you wish to rebel, don't get caught. It's not rocket science.

~Vic

Information about a few of the avatars:

Avatar 1 - "Weapon Master Aleron": This avatar was drawn by GlorDamar to represent Aleron, the weapon master/weapon crafter. However, it can truly be representative of anyone. In Glor's opinion, when he showed it to me before it was released, he commented that it was one of his better bits of artwork.

Avatar 2 - "The wolf": this avatar was drawn by a very old and very respected artisan named Morrel. It is one of the older avatars in the game and one of the few submitted by him.

Avatar 3 - "Smiling Fairy": This avatar is a generation 6 avatar, and I believe it was from a commissioned set by an artist outside of MD. I'm uncertain of this though, I tried to find information regarding the generation 6 set quite some time ago and had very little luck.

As to the value of avatars, it's surely understandable that you have spent a long while gathering these, and that you may have dipped into your own funds to get them, but I would still consider the general value of an avatar. The avatars you buy in the shop are worth one credit, to sell them to the shop, you are given 3 credits. I'm not sure what this would process to in gold/silver/coin, but do keep the prices somewhat fair if you intend to sell them.

Normally I would not agree to this sort of 'buying and selling' at all, but I am glad to see some of the more detailed works being revealed.

These artists no doubt worked hard to create these, and I have said and will always say, let them be viewed.