Udgard

[quote name='Muratus del Mur' timestamp='1323515007' post='97598'] on a second thought, i might make a new spell just for them to allow direct transfer of things easy (by id for example)... [/quote] Maybe a simple interface would be better? There are issues associated with spells such as limited casts (and during "high" seasons there would be a lot of winners that will need to be rewarded, thus depleting casts quickly), and possible (ab)use of the spell outside its intended use (selling of enchanted stones). With an interface I think it might make things easier (or maybe even an item with large cast amount like some of the king items that works like the spell?)

It's a post from half a year ago.

If I have 1 water now, and 2 water at the end of the competition, does that count as 1 resource?

What is the age of the creatures? (will edit with bids once I have the info)

Happy birthday!

Happy birthday fries.

[quote name='Passant the Weak' timestamp='1321721577' post='96202'] Eon puts me in negative in 1 or 2 attacks (compared to my 100 or so attacks I manage to put in one day). You guys are not representative of the entire players population: fresh MP5 or MP4 allies have difficulties to find wins. Not counting getting much from those wins (we pretty much win against trees, or UPs, we can't rival maxed tokened drachs that are seen often around). [/quote] Well, I'm (sadly) quite weak stat-wise. The 6-8 targets I was talking about are 95% made up of targets that had trees or xp loss sponge rits (UPs, eles). Personally, I think the real problem is because people are too afraid to gather together and train because of Eon's stat damage, and this in turn makes it actually hard to outrun the statdamage because there are not enough people around to train with. If people would just ignore the occasional stat damage and gather to train together, I don't think there would be any problem with Eon's stat damage.

[quote name='Sharazhad' timestamp='1321700394' post='96186'] [i] If I were a new mp5 who worked hard on achieving my stats not by grinding only to have them squashed by a troll like Eon, I would never want to play this game again, especially when the developers appear to be nonchalant and doing nothing about it and then blame the players for the lack of action.[/i] [/quote] How much stats does Eon take away in each attack, by the way? Unless things changed from a while ago when I trained more (with Eon and skilldamage attacking me each cooldown), the stats that he reduce is far outweighed by the stats gained from fighting with max heat. I was training with around 3-4 unallied targets available and another 3-4 allied targets, and I was gaining stats without any problem. Am I missing something here? (I haven't been training much lately, so I wouldn't know if there's any change to Eon's stats damage since I last got hit by it).

creature: Elemental (last 2 levels) consumes: wood produces: charcoal production: 0.1

I would assume that's because the player ID is there, which makes it very easy to check who was involved. And while I have no qualms with Nad collecting MB-only water tools, I am a bit disappointed to see that other tools (such as herb baskets, for example) was being hoarded this way too..

Tbh, the announcement is "[b]These items are meant to be used by as many people as possibl[/b][b]e", [/b]and as long as the dowsers were making the tools available to whoever asked who actually can use it (MB Citizens), I don't see the abuse there. If non-citizens can't use them in the first place, then keeping it away from them is not really breaking the rule of "making it available to be used by as many people as possible". Just my 2 cents.

Hi, how much do you value water, and how many do you need?

Regarding the values, some of those places can technically be harvested by an extra 2 herbs, and it will still yield the same, optimum regen. Example is the 30/44 spot, that regens 14 herbs a day, can be harvested to 28/44 and it will still regen 14 herbs a day. Same goes for the 24/35 spot, 12/17 spot etc. It doesn't really make much of a difference in a long run if people keeps harvesting to that value, but it does allow people to harvest an extra 2 herbs if they so really need. Edit: Ah, that's right, I totally missed that. What stavaroiu said is correct, those values are the most optimum values, since fraction regenerations round up.

Happy birthday!

[quote name='phantasm' timestamp='1320839295' post='95523'] The only two lands I know that has a rule regarding resource collection are LR and GG (with the don't deplete <50% rule). And how have these rules balanced the market? The Tribunal has a rule of no depletion under 60%. Though we have no king (that is ever around for its citizens that is) we have all decided upon this rule and do regular checks to see who is depleting resources. If there is a rule in LR its blatantly disregarded, as almost always there is huge amounts of total depletion in that land. [/quote] Thanks for the additional information. I only have access to the land rules page on the citizenship page (which only has the rules for the mainlands), so it's very useful to know the rules of non-main lands. And yes, unfortunately land rules only apply to citizens, so depletion by non-citizens can't be controlled (and it's hard to keep faith that there are no rule breaches by citizens as well - although I would see why citizens would deplete a resource if they saw the resources are being depleted by outsiders anyways). [quote name='Yrthilian' timestamp='1320841367' post='95526'] The Fusioneer's have the responsibility of managing Heat jar's. Before they got turned into public items the heat jars where used and managed by the fusioneers and that is what they are doing. Managing the tool. Personally i dont care about the announcement of the shared tool as it is a complete contradiction to the alliance role. again remember the tool was the alliances before a bunch more got created and put into shared status. So the fact that the fusioneers feel they have a right to manage such a tool is not unjustified. [/quote] Yes, I can see how the fusioneers (and dowsers and woodcutters) would feel it unfair that their tools are suddenly made public. It doesn't really justify abusing "loopholes" (which is even arguable if there's an actual hole there) to maintain monopoly. Besides, doesn't the fusioneers already get the better end of the stick compared to the other 2 resource guilds? From what I understand the fusioneers still have some tools of their own, while the others lost all their tools and must rely on shared ones (CMIIW here). And as a King, I do think it's really your job to do care about rules that are put on announcement. [quote name='Yrthilian' timestamp='1320841367' post='95526'] To answer to whom gave the permission for Mighty P to do as he has been doing. It was me and i stand by that. This is just a case of Mighty finding a loop hole to the rules that have not been plugged. He is not using an alt. The armours are not ALT's they are something else. They are not necessarily dead account's ether. [/quote] Right, the ALT "loophole". If that's your argument, then I would argue this: [quote][b]Severity warning on tool related crime punishments[/b] Getting tools and placing them on alts will be considered a serious crime from now on. If the interface allows you to, you can grab more than one tool or from more than one location, but [b]using more accounts to take more tools from same place is a CRIME[/b]. Because the obvious temptation that is now bigger than ever with all the new tools and the valuable resources, this crime will be punished more severely than normal. Jail time from 2 month to 4 month plus additional penalties such as confiscating resources on all accounts, trade ban and anything else needed based on the severity of your action. Things will get more and more interesting in the upcoming period, don't spend that time in jail and don't waste my or the Councils time to catch you doing this particular crime. To make things "worse" i am placing a bounty reward for anyone successfully spotting such crime and help catching the criminals.[/quote] You can't normally take more than 1 of a certain type of shared item with one account. MP is using the aramors to take more tools from the same place, so if we're going to argue over semantics I can argue that this whole thing is breaking the rules at the first place anyways. You are a king. Mur himself has stated that he will make changes to the system to prevent [b]this [/b]kind of [b]abuse[/b], yet you do not feel compelled to change your policy? [quote name='Yrthilian' timestamp='1320841367' post='95526'] This sort of thing has been done many times in the past and has always been abused. Just when someone has done it with a tool like this now you all complain. Why didn't you moan about the woodcutters and their abuse? But if that is the case then nardolsk i think is it should stop taking all the water tools like he has been as that is a worse case of abuse. that what you lot are moaning about but you have done nothing to stop him or complain much about it. So if you are going to start picking on this sort of thing then bring every one into it that is abusing and not just the one guild or player. But all of them and i mean ALL of them. It is funny how you lot decided to gang up on one player until they give up and not bother others whom have been abusing the system for a much longer time. [/quote] Personally, I didn't complain about this "abuse" of shared tools that the woodcutters and nad are supposedly doing since I don't even know it exists. But I find it utterly ridiculous to tell myself not to do anything about an abuse that does come into my knowledge simply because I do not know of all the other abuses that have been happening. [quote name='Yrthilian' timestamp='1320841367' post='95526'] The only reason this is coming to light is that is has curved the greed a little and the greedy are upset by it. All this has come down to one thing farming what ever you can and abuse it all. To me all you lot are doing is making a mess of what should have been a wonderful system. [/quote] Uh, news flash! I've never even picked a heat jar before and don't have any plan on doing so in the near future. And if it's just greed for resource I could just take the materials I get from making items for people for myself (there's no rule on what I can do with those other than my self-imposed rule, you know). So.. could you tell me why the hell am I here again?

[quote name='Mighty Pirate' timestamp='1320833034' post='95513'] Some remarks (explicitely not for Pips). Currently, the heat jar market is unbalanced. Compare that to resourses where there are land rules in place to balance supply and demand. Currently we have very high supply of heat jars for low demand. So what I do is just a way to balance the market. Remember that the guilds goal is to make money with heat jars. Read the related annoucements. I know that not everybody likes this but that's the way it was announced. As for permission - I asked for permission before and I got permission. As for the announcement cited several times here: I did not use alts for this. I did not hoard items. (Many people hoard stuff, most popular are probably memory stones. I do not.) Items are meant to be used by many people - I absolutely agree to this. Actually, they can be used by all, I'm not aware that there is a single person in this realm who is unable to use a heat jar. If you interpret this announcement as "all should get heat jars for free" - No, this contradicts our guilds goal and it has never been announced that way. A final word to all police men and judges: There is no injured party and no denied privilege. This is just something that you might not like. But that's nothing new, all threads dealing with resources and land laws are full of similar complains. I'm happy to discuss more in a calm way. [/quote] Sadly, I would have to disagree with your argument. First of all thought, I need to ask which resources are you referring to when you say "Compare that to resourses where there are land rules in place to balance supply and demand"? The only two lands I know that has a rule regarding resource collection are LR and GG (with the don't deplete <50% rule). And how have these rules balanced the market? As far as I know, heat is one of the more highly demanded resource, being a resource that is needed for the only creatable cauldron item at the moment (aromatic tea). If you're talking about low demand vs high supply, other "useless" resources such as all the wood products, poison herbs etc would be in a more dire situation than heat. (And I'd like to remind everyone again that heat jars are also usable directly in a cauldron, not just heat stones). Why would heat need such a monopoly more than those other resources? The guild's goal is.. to collect heat. At least that's the only thing mentioned about purpose in the announcements. Yes, guilds are allowed to gather money with the tools you have at your disposal, but I don't think money collection was ever the main purpose of any guild in MD. [quote][b]Fusioneers - New heat based guild[/b] A new resource based guild was founded, based in GG. This guild will gather..HEAT. For that purpose they were provided with advanced tools, Heat jars and associated Heat Solidifiers. The jars will be given to other people to load with heat and return to them. The Fusioneers will be able to store that heat into memory stones and create Heat stones (casting heat spell). For that they will obviously need Memory stone resource in large quantities. Leadership was granted by GG King to Kiley second by Mighty Pirate. 3 more seats left in the guild, but requirements will be very strict, considering the special activity of this guild. [/quote] Please clarify who exactly gave you the permission you mentioned you have. Was it the council/Mur? Since the whole issue would be different if it were.. [quote]As for the announcement cited several times here: I did not use alts for this. [/quote] Although you're treading on a gray area here with "those are not my accounts" stuff, shared tools in the first place are not meant to be just passed around to other accounts(especially "dead accounts" like the aramors) like what you're doing - they're not transferrable except via ITC. Heat jars are a unique in that they can be passed around like normal items, but only because they need to be easily transferrable to use the heat, not so this difference can be abused to hide the tools. What you're doing is clearly not the intended use of the heat jar's transferability. [quote] I did not hoard items. (Many people hoard stuff, most popular are probably memory stones. I do not.)[/quote] The announcement explicitly says it is meant to be used by many people though. How is what you're doing not directly going against what is stated in the announcement? [quote][b]All shared items have been returned to their original place.[/b] Go grab your favorite tool and engoy it till the next regroup. Try avoiding cauldron type items just before this regrouping takes place (same date and hour weekly) as they will regroup even if they are in use. Item keep some of the modified values on regrouping. You should not use alts to store multiple shared items and you should not hoard them, these items are [b]meant to be used by many people[/b] not hoarded by a few.[/quote] [quote]Items are meant to be used by many people - I absolutely agree to this. Actually, they can be used by all, I'm not aware that there is a single person in this realm who is unable to use a heat jar. If you interpret this announcement as "all should get heat jars for free" - No, this contradicts our guilds goal and it has never been announced that way. [/quote] There is lots of people in this realm who is unable to use a heat jar - not when they're hidden away in an empty aramors's hollow suit. Btw, the announcement did announce things "that" way, you know... [quote][b]Shared Tools[/b] A vast majority of tool items will be turned into shared tools. Shared tools can be picked up in a fixed place, probably the capital of each land or other suitable locations. After a time they will spawn back there to be picked up by someone else or same person (time and way they are picked up is not final yet). All current tools except a few ones and the tools marked as "independent" will move to this new way of using tools. The guilds responsible with resources will remain as they are but their purpose will shift to a new direction when their tools will be migrated to the shared system. This is a major concept change and won't come easy to do. [b]During this process all migrated tools can be taken freely from the item dispatch places described[/b], but eventually, tools will be "rented" by each land and resource guilds will have a much better purpose and way to determine hierarchy (based on skill). This way tools will remain always in action and anyone could work for his resource related role and will not depend on joining a guild or receiving such a role as a gift. As always, use the forum for commenting this.[/quote] NB: @passant: thx for the explanation on the mechanics

Huh? I thought shared tools can't be transferred via "give item". Have I gotten it wrong, or could someone enlighten me how you could give a shared tool to an empty aramor? Just curious. And to answer the initial question: no, I don't think using other accounts to store shared items is allowed.

Playing devil's advocate: - Giving people free, regenerable teleport spells defeats the purpose of some other spells. Send to tunnel of war, for example, which were often used to "jail" people would be moot because people would just teleport out right away (unless this was a no-jump location now, last time I was there it weren't). It also circumvents a lot of viscosity, as people would just jump back to paper cabin after venturing deep to, say, the east lands. While this already happens with current teleport spells and alliance jump, making it even more widespread would not be a good idea IMHO. - It would be a good tool for beginners though in case they got stuck (so they don't have to wait until someone with send_to spells to get them out - which could take more than a day), so I would suggest instead a limited, unregenerable cast of papercabin teleport spell for MP3s (activatable after free roam phase, otherwise it might mess with the tutorial shades battle.) There are two options I can think of for this right now: = An untradable enchanted memory stone that is automatically added to the inventory after finishing the initial story mode. (as in maebius's suggestion) = A free MD shop item (like the free regen ritual). This can be further customized to appear only for MP3s (using the same mechanic as the illusion points shop that only appeared for Mp2s and Mp7s) if deemed necessary.

[quote name='asad' timestamp='1320649886' post='95401'] ????? [/quote] Was going to ask if you are entertaining equivalent trade for water atm, but since Pip seems to be interested in buying the branches I withdrew the question

Edit: nvm.

MD. Where dead little girls ask you to play.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner%27s_dilemma I've campaigned against resource depleting long before resources were made shared (which means there's much, much less people to "worry about"), yet it did not work. I've simply lost hope that this would work now that people have the whole realm as competitors.

As far as my understanding goes in the years I've been playing, sharing (and even trading) of information (including secrets and classifieds) were never disallowed. Posting them in publicly accessible places are not allowed, but when it goes to personal level exchange of information, people are always allowed to use whatever resources (be it other valuable information, social connections, and things of trade value) they have at their disposal to gain access to information. CMIIW